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Post by Bunny Hop on Jun 1, 2010 20:57:01 GMT -5
I will always blame the adults in these situations...
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Post by AKAShannon on Jun 1, 2010 20:57:11 GMT -5
I coach my middle school’s Step Team, and they are not Teen AKAs or a junior sorority. There are no jackets, calls, or hand signs! Yet, they are one of, if not the best, step teams in the area! At the beginning of the year, we have tryouts. A student has to be in good and remain in good academic standing and have no major behavior issues in the classroom. Of course, exceptions have been made in order to get an “at-risk-student” on the “right track”. This has been successful on several occasions.
Discipline, respect for self, respect for others, team work, commitment, hardwork, service, and excellence are enforced on a daily basis. These are traits they will need to be successful women! As soon as any member of my team misbehave or don’t turn in an assignment, their teachers run to me. Yes, a lot of it is just petty stuff, and it becomes a pain in the butt. However, I deal accordingly to the situation.
They are quite aware that I am an AKA! Sure, some have express interest, but I don’t force it on them. They are taught to research and think for themselves from the beginning. Alpha Kappa Alpha was my choice, and everyone can’t go that way! ;D
Currently, I have three former members who are AKAs (one I was able to pin), two Deltas, and one Zeta. I am very proud of all of them!
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Post by nsync on Jun 1, 2010 21:11:02 GMT -5
This is awesome especially exception for "at risk". They need love too if not especially. Exalt. I coach my middle school’s Step Team, and they are not Teen AKAs or a junior sorority. There are no jackets, calls, or hand signs! Yet, they are one of, if not the best, step teams in the area! At the beginning of the year, we have tryouts. A student has to be in good and remain in good academic standing and have no major behavior issues in the classroom. Of course, exceptions have been made in order to get an “at-risk-student” on the “right track”. This has been successful on several occasions. Discipline, respect for self, respect for others, team work, commitment, hardwork, service, and excellence are enforced on a daily basis. These are traits they will need to be successful women! As soon as any member of my team misbehave or don’t turn in an assignment, their teachers run to me. Yes, a lot of it is just petty stuff, and it becomes a pain in the butt. However, I deal accordingly to the situation. They are quite aware that I am an AKA! Sure, some have express interest, but I don’t force it on them. They are taught to research and think for themselves from the beginning. Alpha Kappa Alpha was my choice, and everyone can’t go that way! ;D Currently, I have three former members who are AKAs (one I was able to pin), two Deltas, and one Zeta. I am very proud of all of them! |
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Post by nsync on Jun 1, 2010 21:25:53 GMT -5
Wow just wow... talk about folks showing true colors in that thread... Lp8/paperweight held her own. So I totally get the hold down part of her name. She was like the little kid in the play ground fighting all the bullies of the neighborhood and the "innocent" bystanders who throw in a sneaky jab or two in the background. She may have gotten knocked down, but she kept popping back up even if she did get a little delusional towards the end. Kudos to her and her organization for making/choosing a member who is willing to stand strong against adversary. This is essential to new organizations. If you choose it, stand by it! |
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Post by nsync on Jun 1, 2010 21:54:31 GMT -5
I read this thread and I'm going to have to admit bias here. I totally understood what lp8 was saying, but I also can understand why--- for folks coming from a d9 perspective it's jumbled garbage. This may not be the case of her org, but I know in general recently formed orgs, inc and chartered at schools have to have an official clause against hazing. This is good for insurance purposes as well. So I am sure new members of various new orgs are taught they are going through a MIP process and NOT a pledge process(to escape the connection to possible hazing). Semantics We all know semantics. I have seen members of d9 organizations say WE STRICTLY adhere to a MIP process. It's just very detailed. Then turn around and talk about their linemates, bigs,probates and other pledge related terms. I think (and this is just my biased opinion) they are imitating and innovating. They are working many traditions into their culture and they are adding new meanings to them. Everyone who has ever borrowed, imitated, patterned...whatever has done this at some point most likely in the beginning especially. These orgs are in their beginnings. If they are to last they will carve out an established culture of their own. That takes time. I know it may seem like this poster came off as confused and even cocky at times. But it serves her no justice to not defend her org no matter how inconsistent or copy cat it seems to outsiders. Any good member does this. Some just have more "power" when they say "You are not in my org so you don't know the inner workings therefore you can not form any valid opinions." ...that's definitely a new comment.  Okay--- but are non d9 orgs really similar to this? These kids are not only using traditions that are the same but colors and symbols that are either the same or very similar. To me that is mockery. However when another or sees something/or someone from D9 shares it with them and incorporate it within their own culture is that mockery or improvising?
To any D9 org member the notion of actually selecting your line name is so ridiculous it can't be taken serious. When questioned on it, she said that they didn't follow D9 standards (fine) but then preceded to post video of where they marched in to do a neophyte show in a line , and finally reached the summit of Mt. St. Ridiculous when she said that there was only a MIP process, but then spoke of her Big Sisters.
To anyone even remotely initiated into their D9 orgs these things are so ridiculous they reach the level of mockery. They are imitating without understanding. But as long as their bigs say they can do it, why shouldn't they think they can? It's the same thing (IMO) |
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Post by All Pledging Is Legal on Jun 1, 2010 22:30:54 GMT -5
I see a great deal of envy in this post. Maybe some of you guys should be taking notes from the younguns.
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Post by Julie Art on Jun 1, 2010 23:40:13 GMT -5
Lol @ Outtie saying she got delusional at the end! I was standing on the sidelines throwing sneaky jabs but what she said at the end was crazy and no longer funny.
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Post by DamieQue™ on Jun 2, 2010 7:36:32 GMT -5
So because Collegiate Greek organizations existed before the D9 - we are merely copies with flair? I'll be honest, it seems like you are doing your best to avoid context to make a semantic point. There is a difference between having a common root and literally being a copy. By this logic, jazz is to be understood as merely a copy (with flair added) because music itself existed before jazz. It requires you to ignore that jazz represented a signficant departure from what already existed.
But we can go with that: the D9 did not originate collegiate greek letter organizations. What cannot be denied is that we did originate a culture that even who you would call "the originators" imitate now. We represent an undeniable departure from what existed before. The same cannot be said of those who you suggest are merely borrowing from us. I'll give them credit for innovation when they actually do it. When they do step shows, "probate" shows, party hops, strolls, hand signs, calls, have line names, line numbers, or lines period - they aren't borrowing "general concepts"... they are borrowing "unique concepts" that didn't exist until we created them.
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Post by DamieQue™ on Jun 2, 2010 7:48:04 GMT -5
I look forward to hearing what said innovation(s) are. Changing the title of an existing tradition does not represent innovation. Doing something that hasn't been done before represents innovation. And it doesn't take time - it just takes creativity and originality.
And also, it's not like the D9 took every idea known to man. There is plenty of stuff that we haven't done that they could make their own. They just haven't done it by and large, opting instead to borrow from us. As a new org they could just as easily decide that no one gets a line name within the organization during initation, instead maybe they get assigned a poem. Or maybe they could decide that they each person pick their favorite animal to represent them in the org. THAT would at least be something different . I think (and this is just my biased opinion) they are imitating and innovating. They are working many traditions into their culture and they are adding new meanings to them.Everyone who has ever borrowed, imitated, patterned...whatever has done this at some point most likely in the beginning especially. These orgs are in their beginnings. If they are to last they will carve out an established culture of their own. That takes time. I know it may seem like this poster came off as confused and even cocky at times. But it serves her no justice to not defend her org no matter how inconsistent or copy cat it seems to outsiders. Any good member does this. Some just have more "power" when they say "You are not in my org so you don't know the inner workings therefore you can not form any valid opinions." ...that's definitely a new comment. To my mind's eye - yeah it is. In part because of imitation doesn't require sharing. You just have to observe some stuff from the surface and replicate it (this applies to non-D9 orgs). A good example occured not too long on SH, where a young lady was trying to explain how she "selected" her line name of Lyrical PaperwEIGHT.
To any D9 org member the notion of actually selecting your line name is so ridiculous it can't be taken serious. When questioned on it, she said that they didn't follow D9 standards (fine) but then preceded to post video of where they marched in to do a neophyte show in a line , and finally reached the summit of Mt. St. Ridiculous when she said that there was only a MIP process, but then spoke of her Big Sisters.
To anyone even remotely initiated into their D9 orgs these things are so ridiculous they reach the level of mockery. They are imitating without understanding. But as long as their bigs say they can do it, why shouldn't they think they can? It's the same thing (IMO)
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Post by Bunny Hop on Jun 2, 2010 8:39:04 GMT -5
Maybe we should just start bumping old threads...that way folks wouldn't have to keep typing the same stuff over and over and over again, LOL.
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Post by Cambist on Jun 2, 2010 8:55:55 GMT -5
<<<== going to bump an old thread
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Post by Coldfront06 on Jun 6, 2010 16:51:31 GMT -5
A picture from a "probate" at my former high school. They call themselves Gamma Phi Chill. This has been going on for 15 years or so at that school.  |
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Post by Julie Art on Jun 6, 2010 18:24:44 GMT -5
Gamma Phi Chill? Interesting. Here is a question to all the greeks, would you allow your children to participate in something like this, I.E. The probating' line names, etc? What if it was one very similar to a BGLO?
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Post by AKAShannon on Jun 6, 2010 21:56:53 GMT -5
^^^NO!
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Post by Southie on Jun 7, 2010 16:03:29 GMT -5
Ok, now my opinion... I see pros and cons.. I was in one of these groups in high school, the Mademoiselles, we stepped however we didn't probate.. alot had changed though since I was in the group over 15 years ago! Its not cool that they mimic our orgs so damn close but, we can't really blame them, the persons over these orgs are members of our orgs and they are making them into "mine-mes".. we didn't have calls, signs, line jackets and numbers, and all that back in the day, the persons over these groups (us) have incorporated this over the years to be more like us! Why? Don't know, maybe to try to make it into something more "official" rather than just another after school group. However, if you weren't in ROTC or playing some kind of sports, you were pretty much out of luck as far as any extra-curricular activities and well, some kids just need other things to do to stay out of trouble. I know I use to help with a group of girls, they were 5th graders, and well, some of these girls were probably 2 grades behind behind because school & grades weren't important to them. I know our group helped a lot of these young girls because they had to keep up their grades and conduct in school to participate.. Sometimes, when you give a child something to work for/towards, it makes a difference. I just remembered how I reacted when I saw this...I could not believe it! I like the positive aspect but some of it was just wayyy too much. However, doing a so called "probate" show for high school students (children/very young adults) is ridiculous. O.k so you get to college and then what? |
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Post by Southie on Jun 7, 2010 16:35:55 GMT -5
Gamma Phi Chill? Interesting. Here is a question to all the greeks, would you allow your children to participate in something like this, I.E. The probating' line names, etc? What if it was one very similar to a BGLO? Uh no. <<mom would not be nice addressing this situation |
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Post by Chal™ on Jun 7, 2010 16:42:31 GMT -5
you guys have to consider the fact that some. scratch that, MANY of the parents are not familair with Greek life. Many of them DID't go to college and therefore don't see where their children are mimicing something that should be held closer to you guys' chest. all these parents know is that a member of these orgs are acting as mentors for these children and as mentors, they are okaying the "processes." The kids nor the parents are to blame (unless the parents are GLO members). The people pushing these "programs" are.
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Post by Southie on Jun 7, 2010 17:25:35 GMT -5
you guys have to consider the fact that some. scratch that, MANY of the parents are not familair with Greek life. Many of them DID't go to college and therefore don't see where their children are mimicing something that should be held closer to you guys' chest. all these parents know is that a member of these orgs are acting as mentors for these children and as mentors, they are okaying the "processes." The kids nor the parents are to blame (unless the parents are GLO members). The people pushing these "programs" are. That is true and a very good point. However, with more people having access to the internet, its kind of hard to get around the familarity(sp) factor. I don't know, I will ponder on that one. However, for me that would not work. Joining an aux group in HS is o.k but there are boundaries. |
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Post by Chal™ on Jun 7, 2010 17:45:01 GMT -5
I agree, Southie. They may be familiar with the orgs, but they don't know the historical significance behind certain things. Had I never attended college, and my kid was a part of this, I wouldn't know that there was a cultural value to something like stepping. I'd think it was just like some dance routine you guys did in shows and parties. So ok, my kid's gonna do a dance routine in a show. cool. But in all reality, it isn't.
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Post by nsync on Jun 7, 2010 18:10:28 GMT -5
The majority of my family (both sides) know virtually nothing about greek life and they all have internet. The very few who do think they are evil. I was shocked when my dad said...I wish one of you(talking to me and siblings) would have joined a fraternity, because every time I turn around I hear Kappa alpha this and Kappa alpha that. lol
I think you make an excellent point. Folks have to place the blame where it belongs and leave it there.
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Post by Coldfront06 on Jun 7, 2010 18:11:10 GMT -5
you guys have to consider the fact that some. scratch that, MANY of the parents are not familair with Greek life. Many of them DID't go to college and therefore don't see where their children are mimicing something that should be held closer to you guys' chest. all these parents know is that a member of these orgs are acting as mentors for these children and as mentors, they are okaying the "processes." The kids nor the parents are to blame (unless the parents are GLO members). The people pushing these "programs" are. That is true and a very good point. However, with more people having access to the internet, its kind of hard to get around the familarity(sp) factor. I don't know, I will ponder on that one. However, for me that would not work. Joining an aux group in HS is o.k but there are boundaries. Believe it or not, not everyone uses the internet either. My youngest brother is in high school. My parents are 1) not familiar with Greek life and 2) not computer savvy. If he wanted to join a "high school fraternity," they would not have a clue that he was "mimicking" BGLOs. As long as it wasn't interfering with his grades, he wasn't getting into any kind of trouble, etc. they would absolutely be OK with it. Hell, many of the kids involved don't know any better. This is solely the fault of the members of our organizations who come up with this stuff. |
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Post by Julie Art on Jun 7, 2010 20:23:54 GMT -5
Notice I said was asking that question for those who ARE greek Chal for their kids for the same reason you posed. I was wondering what people who are BGLO afflitaed thought of their kids mimcking greek orgs in highschool. I too place blame on the advisors for encouraging this.
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Post by NOLA Darling on Jun 8, 2010 0:36:09 GMT -5
I have seen high school step teams rocking line numbers and jackets. My question is always "what are they learning". If they are learning Greek alphabet and loyalty, sisterhood or brotherhood, volunteering in their school and communities, then why trip over the name they choose to call themselves. So they call themselves Alpha Beta whoopdeewhoop. So what they step. Did they help with that Habitat for Humanity project? Did they clean up that park? What's REALLY important here?
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Post by Southie on Jun 8, 2010 9:20:18 GMT -5
Notice I said was asking that question for those who ARE greek Chal for their kids for the same reason you posed. I was wondering what people who are BGLO afflitaed thought of their kids mimcking greek orgs in highschool. I too place blame on the advisors for encouraging this. My org has aux groups and if I had a daughter, she could join, but don't let me even get wind of some shenigans. Sorors would have to answer to Southside in the worst way. Those types of activities are no way a part of the aux group. So please do not tell me about so- called "making" folks. |
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Post by Julie Art on Jun 8, 2010 11:14:38 GMT -5
I mean it is one thing to join a org that is sponsored by a BGLO and they are doing mentorship, community service, etc., but er ummm, you got a line name and number, a call, walking around talking about you put in blood, sweat, and tears, party hopping? Uh, Houston we have a problem.
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Post by Southie on Jun 8, 2010 11:25:32 GMT -5
I mean it is one thing to join a org that is sponsored by a BGLO and they are doing mentorship, community service, etc., but er ummm, you got a line name and number, a call, walking around talking about you put in blood, sweat, and tears, party hopping? Uh, Houston we have a problem. Exactly. My child or children would definatley know better. Don't let me ask questions, and I know you don't have answers. At least you better not have answers.  |
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Post by Julie Art on Jun 8, 2010 11:26:36 GMT -5
LOL @ Southie!
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Post by DamieQue™ on Jun 8, 2010 11:27:15 GMT -5
Notice I said was asking that question for those who ARE greek Chal for their kids for the same reason you posed. I was wondering what people who are BGLO afflitaed thought of their kids mimcking greek orgs in highschool. I too place blame on the advisors for encouraging this.
The only way to really understand the D9 is to be in it (my opinion). You can't do it by mimicking what you see - you make a mockery of it when you do (whether you or aided and abetted by actual D9 members, or if you take it upon yourself to appropriate what you see on the surface) it's all mockery.
I mean I looked at the video of the dudes in the Omega aux going back and forth with the dudes in the Alpha aux - like they were actually repping either or. You're not the Bruhz. You are not Alphas. There is nothing to be going back and forth over. |
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Post by Chal™ on Jun 8, 2010 11:27:05 GMT -5
I noticed, J. I'm just point out that a lot of the parents are not Greek, so even if you guys didn't let your kids participate, there are many others who will. I guess some people see it as progression. I say that because we had these orgs when I was in high school, but there was no line jackets, but there were jackets with the name of the org on the back and the year you joined on the front. There were no calls, but there was a hand sign, and the guys in Kappa League did walk around with canes. There were no coming out shows, or stepshows, but there was participation (under the name of the group) in talent shoes. Now, some schools did pledge the guys, but not all. And all of the advisors were Greek. One advisor, however, WAS NOT GOING!!! She made it VERY CLEAR this is NOT a sorority. This is NOT a stepping stone into a sorority. This is a HIGH SCHOOL SERVICE ORGANIZATION and you WILL be kicked out if you misrepresent the others.
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Post by Julie Art on Jun 8, 2010 11:40:52 GMT -5
Notice I said was asking that question for those who ARE greek Chal for their kids for the same reason you posed. I was wondering what people who are BGLO afflitaed thought of their kids mimcking greek orgs in highschool. I too place blame on the advisors for encouraging this.
The only way to really understand the D9 is to be in it (my opinion). You can't do it by mimicking what you see - you make a mockery of it when you do (whether you or aided and abetted by actual D9 members, or if you take it upon yourself to appropriate what you see on the surface) it's all mockery.
I mean I looked at the video of the dudes in the Omega aux going back and forth with the dudes in the Alpha aux - like they were actually repping either or. You're not the Bruhz. You are not Alphas. There is nothing to be going back and forth over. LOL! I see nothihng wrong with doing a step show, as long as their show isn't reminisciant of any D9 org, nor are they throwing up handsigns and doing calls, etc. When it becomes to look to much like a D9 sorority or org (i.e. what you mentioned Damie, or that one chick with that damn jacket on that had that big azz ivy on the back of a pink jacket and a shield to close for dayum comfort  ) that is where the problem lies. |
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