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Post by DamieQue™ on Jun 15, 2010 12:43:49 GMT -5
Just of curiosity who do you all think won?
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Post by Vudu_Prince on Jun 15, 2010 23:55:29 GMT -5
rounds 2 n three were blah... round 1 was the joint and big dude killed the other dude with the Lebron James the remains of her. lol
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Post by DamieQue™ on Jun 16, 2010 7:08:18 GMT -5
rounds 2 n three were blah... round 1 was the joint and big dude killed the other dude with the Lebron James the remains of her. lol
Plus one of Diablo's illest rhymes they didn't seem to catch. When he mentioned being a blood, that uses his fork to eat his food? It completely went over the heads of most of the people in there who were supposed to be from Chicago.
Funny thing is, that battle was the undercard, the main event went even harder. Math Hoffa vs. T-Rex (Math was the first dude to body Iron Solomon in a match up - and he bodied T-Rex this time out too) |
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Post by Alc 06 on Jun 16, 2010 10:25:07 GMT -5
Have you seen this battle? (and I use the term "battle" loosely)
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Post by Vudu_Prince on Jun 16, 2010 11:40:58 GMT -5
Have you seen this battle? (and I use the term "battle" loosely) WTF lol. Hell naw |
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Post by DJ Firecracker on Jun 16, 2010 17:23:54 GMT -5
Have you seen this battle? (and I use the term "battle" loosely) ROTFLMAO - There are some things you just dont joke about... |
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Post by DamieQue™ on Jul 13, 2010 16:10:06 GMT -5
Not a URL Freestyle battle... but a good battle. (Is it me or are most of the good batter rappers white?)
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Post by suavesince1911 on Jul 14, 2010 21:11:29 GMT -5
Not a URL Freestyle battle... but a good battle. (Is it me or are most of the good batter rappers white?) Damie, it's not you. I have been following the underground battle circuit for a long time, and I would say the best MCs I have seen perform are white: Eyedea, Adeem, Sage Francis, Slug, Illmaculate, Iron Solomon, Thesaurus, etc. Many people on the underground circuit believe Thesaurus is the best battle MC. In March, he flew to Canada, and handily defeated arguably their best MC in their battle circuit: Hollohan. When one takes into account Thesaurus's accolades over the past 3-5 years, it is difficult to argue against his acclaim. Having said that, I think his groupies tend to nuthug him a little too much at times, and when he actually loses a battle, they cry "robbery." Nevertheless, he is in an elite class at this time. In this particular battle, I think Dirtbag Dan (another dope MC I like) won two out of three rounds. The third round was all Thesaurus; I think his double-time rebuttal was just SICK. I like these kinds of MCs better because they don't place such a heavy emphasis on guns and drugs like some of their black counterparts. Although, I will admit that some of the thug rappers can be dope at times. Check out some of Conceited's Grind Time/URL battles. He utters a lot of gun talk, but he is very creative and metaphorical. He is one of the FEW thug rappers I like. I REALLY want to see Thesaurus battle Serious Jones, but I doubt that will ever happen. |
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Post by DamieQue™ on Jul 15, 2010 16:51:39 GMT -5
Not a URL Freestyle battle... but a good battle. (Is it me or are most of the good batter rappers white?) Damie, it's not you. I have been following the underground battle circuit for a long time, and I would say the best MCs I have seen perform are white: Eyedea, Adeem, Sage Francis, Slug, Illmaculate, Iron Solomon, Thesaurus, etc. Many people on the underground circuit believe Thesaurus is the best battle MC. In March, he flew to Canada, and handily defeated arguably their best MC in their battle circuit: Hollohan. When one takes into account Thesaurus's accolades over the past 3-5 years, it is difficult to argue against his acclaim. Having said that, I think his groupies tend to nuthug him a little too much at times, and when he actually loses a battle, they cry "robbery." Nevertheless, he is in an elite class at this time. In this particular battle, I think Dirtbag Dan (another dope MC I like) won two out of three rounds. The third round was all Thesaurus; I think his double-time rebuttal was just SICK. I like these kinds of MCs better because they don't place such a heavy emphasis on guns and drugs like some of their black counterparts. Although, I will admit that some of the thug rappers can be dope at times. Check out some of Conceited's Grind Time/URL battles. He utters a lot of gun talk, but he is very creative and metaphorical. He is one of the FEW thug rappers I like. I REALLY want to see Thesaurus battle Serious Jones, but I doubt that will ever happen.
When they battled each other (I.S. vs. T) it was clear that T was freestyling just about everything, while I.S. had his writtens ready.
When you first turned me onto I.S. I thought dude was a beast (based on his battle against Madness). He took Madness apart based on what appeared to be pure freestyles. But as you watch more and more of Solomon's battles you can tell they're pre-written. That's why when he went up against Math Hoffa I figured he was going to lose and that's exactly what he did.
Thesaurus on the other hand freestyles multiples on a regular.
p.s. I honestly thought they were tied on Rounds 1 and 2 but Round 3 clearly went to Thesaurus. The Double Time Reply saved the day. Because it was tied pretty much up to the point.
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Post by suavesince1911 on Jul 15, 2010 20:25:45 GMT -5
Damie, it's not you. I have been following the underground battle circuit for a long time, and I would say the best MCs I have seen perform are white: Eyedea, Adeem, Sage Francis, Slug, Illmaculate, Iron Solomon, Thesaurus, etc. Many people on the underground circuit believe Thesaurus is the best battle MC. In March, he flew to Canada, and handily defeated arguably their best MC in their battle circuit: Hollohan. When one takes into account Thesaurus's accolades over the past 3-5 years, it is difficult to argue against his acclaim. Having said that, I think his groupies tend to nuthug him a little too much at times, and when he actually loses a battle, they cry "robbery." Nevertheless, he is in an elite class at this time. In this particular battle, I think Dirtbag Dan (another dope MC I like) won two out of three rounds. The third round was all Thesaurus; I think his double-time rebuttal was just SICK. I like these kinds of MCs better because they don't place such a heavy emphasis on guns and drugs like some of their black counterparts. Although, I will admit that some of the thug rappers can be dope at times. Check out some of Conceited's Grind Time/URL battles. He utters a lot of gun talk, but he is very creative and metaphorical. He is one of the FEW thug rappers I like. I REALLY want to see Thesaurus battle Serious Jones, but I doubt that will ever happen.
When they battled each other (I.S. vs. T) it was clear that T was freestyling just about everything, while I.S. had his writtens ready.
When you first turned me onto I.S. I thought dude was a beast (based on his battle against Madness). He took Madness apart based on what appeared to be pure freestyles. But as you watch more and more of Solomon's battles you can tell they're pre-written. That's why when he went up against Math Hoffa I figured he was going to lose and that's exactly what he did.
Thesaurus on the other hand freestyles multiples on a regular.
p.s. I honestly thought they were tied on Rounds 1 and 2 but Round 3 clearly went to Thesaurus. The Double Time Reply saved the day. Because it was tied pretty much up to the point.
Damie, Grind Time is a written battle league. That is pretty widely accepted. Some of the MCs will freestyle and flip a few of their opponent's lines, but it is primarily a written league. In fact, most participants know weeks (possibly months) in advance who they will battle, so many of them will have pre-writtens prepared. Not many battle circuits are freestyle/off the dome like they used to be. Probably the main battle arena that is strictly freestyle is Scribble Jam. Writtens are pretty much useless in Scribble Jam because an MC does not know who he will battle from one round to the next, and the participant has to be more personal. Now that I think about it, even when I research some of the live battles in previous eras such as legends like Grandmaster Caz vs. Melle Mel, or Lord Finesse vs. Percee P, their battles contained a mixture of freestyle and writtens as well. Grandmaster Caz spit lines that were on wax, and Lord Finesse recited lines he spit on the Funky Technician. I have even heard Big Daddy Kane recycle lines and spit material he had on his albums. If an MC can manipulate writtens and freestyles in his battles, and it's not against the rules, I say do what it takes to win. As for Iron Solomon, he admitted a while back that he does not totally freestyle. He parallels his rap battle approach to "gumbo" where he can combine a mixture of written and freestyle against his opponent. I don't think there is anything wrong with that, and the judges usually do not hold it against him. I am pretty sure in quite a few of his battles, both he and his opponent knew in advance they would battle, so both likely came with some written material. But I have to give it to Solomon; despite his blatant written material, he will come with some nice freestyle rebuttals. Iron Solomon was a finalist in Scribble Jam and Brainstorm Battle, so he has also thrived in primarily freestyle battles as well. As for his battle against Math Hoffa, I was a little skeptical about the entire battle. Math Hoffa had much more time to spit his lines than Solomon. The time disparity was heavily in Math's favor, but I will say Math held his own well. Solomon kind of fell off a little after round one, but his first round was straight HEAT! "We had the chemistry, attracted physical, taught her sex ed and wood shop/ now Math is history/" Math may have been funnier, but I think Solomon was more clever; it all depends on whose style you like the best. Personally, I don't think Solomon brought his best material anyway. That battle wasn't even judged. |
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Post by Vudu_Prince on Jul 15, 2010 20:46:03 GMT -5
No White battle rappers are not better. Most I have heard if you listen to these two guys here are really Slam Poets who rap. To me they are doing slam poetry and not true fresstyle rhymin. Furthermore the white rapper is still a novelty with only a few that are truly truly dope like El-P and Aesop Rock. Both of them would stomp a mud hole in Marshall Mathers.
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Post by Iceman on Jul 16, 2010 10:13:37 GMT -5
It’s funny, coming up in the 80’s and actually speaking with some of the credible lyricists during that era, I have always understood freestyles to be written/prepared rhymes that didn’t necessarily have a structure, follow any set subject matter, and weren’t really written for a song or intended for an album.
When we used the term “freestyle” or actually did it in the park or at school, it was never off the top. It was basically everybody in a cipher just spitting bars that they wrote bigging up themselves, or bragging about how dope they were. Sometimes, if the bars went over really well, an MC would just incorporate the best lines into a song they did.
It seems like the early to mid 90’s was when the term took on a different meaning with “off the top” being used to describe it. The first one to really rely "heavily" on it and get a lot of attention for it was Supernatural (and to a lesser degree the Hieroglyphics crew from Oakland). Around that time Craig G. from the Juice Crew also reinvented himself on the underground by becoming skilled at going off the top (He actually battled Supernat a few times I believe).
But that off the top style wasn’t really as prevalent in the mid to late 80’s on the East Coast (as far as I can remember). The only person I can really remember from that era who really had fun with it from day one and use to spit off the top at live shows was Biz (more comical than dope). But even his most memorable work was all written by Antonio Hardy a.k.a Big Daddy Kane.
And speaking of Kane, here is a clip of him speaking on the subject of “Freestyle” and his interpretation of the term. I’ve always understood it to coincide with what he’s saying. And IMO, when there is confusion or doubt on a matter such as this, who more credible to speak on it than a cat who is pretty much domestically and internationally recognized as a “Top 5 Dead or Alive” lyricist:
What ya'll think?
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Post by DamieQue™ on Jul 16, 2010 11:10:59 GMT -5
I hear you Suave, I just thought (based on his battle with Madness) that I.S. was doing it all Freestyling because he literally took Madness apart in real time. He talked about what the dude was wearing and stuff Madness was saying in his previous verse and there was no way he could have prepared for that ahead of time. I saw some of his other battles and heard lines repeated and knew that it wasn't all freestyle and that's where he lost some luster to me.
And I saw I.S. battle at Scribble Jam - the dude from Australia (Justice) murked him. I wanted to give him the nod - but there was no way I could realistically do it based on the performance. And it's not like Justice was wack, he beat Thesaurus too btw. It just seemed like when I.S. had to spit to a beat against a good freestyler he panicked and did a written that didn't have anything to do with Justice and Justice pounced on it - he just wasn't on his A-Game for that round and it cost him.
Unlike anyone else that battled I.S., Math had seen Iron's footage, he knew what I.S. was doing (mixing frees with writtens... which by the way Math does too). The battle against I.S. wasn't really a battle, it was an ambush. He was lying in wait for I.S. and most people who knew who Math was - knew how it was going to unfold. I don't think I.S. brought his A-Game then either and it seemed to me, he REALLY needed to.
@vp: Alot of the dudes on the Battle Circuit Right now are white. I agree that they're not really freestylin' - more pre-stylin' if anything else. But alot of the white dudes are part of that Bay Area Movement and some of them do freestyle. Within the industry and established hip hop I agree with you they are still a novelty (both in terms of broad acceptance from the hip hop community and in terms of them pushing units).
Aesop is cool (I actually like his song None Shall Pass)... I don't think he's better than Em. He does have a good flow and delivery though.
@ice
Alot of people are pointing that out, that in Old School freestyles, they were writtens. I know on the wiki page they give alot of credit to the Freestyle Fellowship for redifining freestyle into it's new definition (which was previously called "off the top"). But I am confident that Phife and KRS-One were doing off the tops and calling it freestyle before Freestyle Fellowship. I remember seeing performances both live and on t.v.
And obviously to me, a freestyle is unwritten. Nuff respect to BDK and Kool Moe Dee and others that say Freestyles used to be written, but now - it needs to be off the dome or not at all.
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Post by Vudu_Prince on Jul 16, 2010 16:35:20 GMT -5
I feel you Damie but these white dudes in this thread are not rhyming in my estimation. They are doing Slam Poetry. Folks don't realize Slam Poets go in on each other just like rappers do. They can't really fuck with real lyricist.
@ice I partially disagree with Big Daddy Kane because in the beginning most rhyming was freestyle off the dome. Rhyming was impromptu during break beats. Now I will agree when mofo started battling each other then yeah people did start pre writing rhymes fa sho. I do agree with the beat being important to freestyling. Meaning you don't know what beat will drop and you have to go through your mental rolodex to find an appropriate rhyme to go with it.
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Post by All Pledging Is Legal on Jul 16, 2010 22:45:28 GMT -5
All I saw was a bunch of monkeys hooting and hollering about nothing.
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Post by LogAKAlly <3'n Keef on Jul 17, 2010 18:31:16 GMT -5
SQUARE PANTS SPONGE FACE!!!!!!
HELP ME!!
OMG!! That mofo said when you stick your face out of a moving car it whistles!!!
WTF!!!
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