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Post by DamieQue™ on Aug 1, 2008 12:15:35 GMT -5
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Post by LogAKAlly <3'n Keef on Aug 1, 2008 12:29:25 GMT -5
<head down in shame>
<walks casually to the back of the bus>
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Post by DamieQue™ on Aug 1, 2008 12:36:10 GMT -5
It's like we'd rather lose a war to win a small meaningless battle. Can you imagine someone protesting Dr. King like this back in the 60's?
@#$%@#$ idiots... I swear.
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Post by intensify on Aug 1, 2008 12:38:19 GMT -5
Damie, could you explain what you believe "winning the war" will be exactly?
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Post by DamieQue™ on Aug 1, 2008 12:45:00 GMT -5
As close an approximation to a colorblind society as possible. THAT would be winning the war for me.
And your take?
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Post by intensify on Aug 1, 2008 13:04:34 GMT -5
While I think people ought to vote, it is unfortunate that voting for a president is revered as the quintessential duty of citizens (not implying that this is true for you, but in response to the video). In the grand scope of things any president is going to move the country along in the general direction that it has always gone, and act in the manner that presidents are expected to act. A lot of Black people are going to be disappointed when they realize that Obama is just a president and is not going to fix the basic issues ingrained in a racist society, and those hecklers are getting a head start in expecting someting he can't give them.
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Post by Bunny Hop on Aug 1, 2008 13:42:15 GMT -5
Sometimes we get on my nerves. When will we understand that it's not just us here in the USA? We are called minorities for a reason so at what point will we understand that it's not just our vote that will win him the Presidency. People are so freaking ridiculous. As far as bringing Jena 6 up...that burns me up every single time.
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Post by Bunny Hop on Aug 1, 2008 13:44:06 GMT -5
And all those hecklers were probably calling Bill Clinton our "First Black President" and supporting Hillary Clinton. I bet they came about VERY late in the race and so are misinformed like he said.
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Post by DamieQue™ on Aug 1, 2008 13:52:46 GMT -5
EDTIORIAL TO ENSUE
It IS the quintessential duty of black people in my opinion to vote. Considering our history and our current share of power in America we have NO business failing to vote in large numbers whether there's a black man or woman running or not.
That said I both agree and disagree with you. George Bush notwithstanding, we don't often elect Presidents who steer the country in a radically new direction. As has been illustrated during this election cycle and past election cycles, people find change "frightening". So I agree there will be no radical policy shift that suddenly lifts black people (or any people for that matter) out of poverty. What he has proposed IS somewhat different than his predecessors and could affect positive change and a slightly new direction (the partial banning of lobbyists and their influence) - but we aren't likely to see anything radical - nor would you have seen it from Clinton or McCain. At worst, he will be a welcome change from the ignorant cowboy brand of leadership by Bush.
So my concern is not him creating policy that fixes problems... if we are not aware by now that policy DOESN'T fix many of our problems we're even further on the lunatic fringe of politics than I thought. It's not policies that Barack can change radically it's ideas and perspectives.
Ask yourself: What policies did Jesse Owens enact by his participation in the 1936 Olympics? What legislation was passed by Jack Johnson when he won the heavy weight boxing championship? What laws were enacted by Jackie Robinson? The Tuskeegee Airmen? I continue now, as I have in the past, to argue that to be successful, Barack need only win and comport himself as President as he has as a candidate. What he can not do as a legislator, he can most certainly do as a symbol.
As we have witnessed during the Democratic primaries, there are many white people out there who STILL have a problem with people of color - for no other reason BUT color. A win by Barack doesn't just send us a message it sends THEM a message. Their day is coming to an end. This country is a non-stop celebration of their collective cultural greatness. The streets, the cities, the towns, the statues, the monuments, the parks, the money, the holidays, the highways, the states, the counties, principally named for and in celebration to them. All while ignoring the atrocities and injustices that they perpetuated to get there.
For years they have been able to live in this cocoon safely believing that they are the paragons of virtue - never having to struggle with media images and portrayal. They are free to believe that they have power, wealth, legacy, and prestige - because they were just destined to do so. And for years we have been knocking down that bastard child of "Manifest Destiny" one lie at a time. First it was that blacks couldn't be educated, or that we could never be heavy weight champion, or that we lacked the intelligence and courage to fly in combat, or that we couldn't be managers, or that we couldn't be officers in the Armed forces, or that we couldn't be Executive Officers of a business... so on and so on ad infinitum. We've knocked them all down. Here is the last bastion for them, the last exclusive club they have had to themselves. And here we are knocking at the door about to come in. Here we are about to change not only the perceptions of little black and brown children here and abroad, but we are also about to change the perception of white people everywhere.
Once we have done it once - it is no longer an impossibility. Other black children, little girls and boys will aspire to the position because we KNOW it can be done. Their eyes are opened to a new horizon that many of us never could have imagined - and without ever passing any policy or legislation that changes things - by winning he changes perception FOREVER. And that will be a giant step on our path (which will undoubtedly continue long after this election) towards truly being included in this country that we have built. WE - not just them - WE.
Now with that as the back drop - someone explain to me why I would trade ALL of this, for Barack speaking about Jena 6 and Sean Bell - when as best I can tell, as a community even WE AREN'T talking about it?
THAT is my problem. It is not that I am without empathy... I have had family killed unjustly by police also. But I am NOT demanding that Barack address that at the cost of the big picture. What he can give you is so much BIGGER than what they're asking for. And if he gave them what they were asking for - it could (and likely WOULD) be at the cost of something FAR BIGGER. Am I the only one that sees this?
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Post by Mrs. Eyes on Aug 1, 2008 13:53:34 GMT -5
And all those hecklers were probably calling Bill Clinton our "First Black President" and supporting Hillary Clinton. I bet they came about VERY late in the race and so are misinformed like he said. BINGO! Here we have the opportunity for a REAL BLACK PRESIDENT and some fucking idiots are CRYING and WHINING because he's not focusing MAINLY on Black issues? Obama is focusing on EVERYONE! If Obama was bias just to Black issues, alone, he wouldn't have the supporters he does now. I want those idiots to get some cheese with they whine and shut up and put their arms up in a corner! |
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Post by Search1906 on Aug 1, 2008 13:54:16 GMT -5
I don't know if anyone remember but I said this would happen. Folks have gotten all hype that we may have a black president and have not taken time to think what that means. He will be president of all which means he has to address all concerns of every group to the best of his ability. I knew the minute it looked like he wasn't "down for the cause" folks would get disappointed and start tripping. Some ignoramouses thought we'd be having Grill outs on the South lawn of the White house and rims on the presidential limo will be disappointed. This is sad but true.
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Post by Mrs. Eyes on Aug 1, 2008 13:55:27 GMT -5
It's a damn shame.............................
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Post by Robelite on Aug 1, 2008 15:26:38 GMT -5
Y'all know that some of us just have to have our "agendas," and when given the opportunity, will show their WHOLE black asses in public places at the most inappropriate times.
I wouldn't be suprised to find out those ignut asses aren't even registered to vote!!
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Post by intensify on Aug 1, 2008 15:39:44 GMT -5
I guess where we differ is that it seems like your focus is in changing personal prejudices, which I don't think Obama's presidency will do a whole lot of. I think racially ignorant perspectives are hardly based in reality anyway, so a shining example may change some minds (although for most he will simply be labeled an exception) but won't ultimately transform society.
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Post by Julie Art on Aug 1, 2008 15:53:55 GMT -5
Didn't read everyone's response, but I want our people to further do what they are doing because it will make Obama look better in other races eyes, i.e. he won't just focus on the black folks issues, he'll focus on everyone. I mean, can we get the man in office first?
As far as how they treated him with the heckling: Niggas and flies. That's all I got to say.
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Post by DamieQue™ on Aug 1, 2008 16:11:38 GMT -5
I guess where we differ is that it seems like your focus is in changing personal prejudices, which I don't think Obama's presidency will do a whole lot of. I think racially ignorant perspectives are hardly based in reality anyway, so a shining example may change some minds (although for most he will simply be labeled an exception) but won't ultimately transform society.
With each barrier we knock down we force them to reconcile themselves, their beliefs, their actions, and the actions of this country - with reality. Likewise we expand the realm of possibilities for black and brown children of what they can do.
What policy or what legistlation was EVER going to accomplish that?
Haven given my view - what in your view is the way to proceed? What is the path to "victory" for black people in America? |
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Post by Vudu_Prince on Aug 1, 2008 16:46:22 GMT -5
this was staged.. good chit obama. He knew about the Hecklers and that Big Ass Sign before he even started speaking. Probably even told them what questions to ask. Once again this riles up White Folks into thinking he isnt a black candidate and gets their votes. This brother is pimping the system. Good chit!
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Post by DamieQue™ on Aug 1, 2008 16:52:15 GMT -5
VP
I did actually consider that - since it's clear that the McCain camp is going to try to insert the race card every chance they get...
...still I think making race an issue ultimately hurts Barack... even in this instance. Yes he shows white people that he is not beholden to the black community - but it is once again making race the issue front and center.
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Post by Prissy New Year!!! on Aug 1, 2008 21:29:15 GMT -5
Damie for VP!!!
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Post by intensify on Aug 1, 2008 22:35:55 GMT -5
The belief that a black couldn't be a fighter pilot or a lawyer or a heavyweight champion wasn't based on reality either - if those notions were never challenged many of them (I suspect) would still be in place today. Tuskeegee airmen didn't change the world... but there are black pilots now (commerical and combat) aren't there?
With each barrier we knock down we force them to reconcile themselves, their beliefs, their actions, and the actions of this country - with reality. Likewise we expand the realm of possibilities for black and brown children of what they can do.
What policy or what legistlation was EVER going to accomplish that?
Haven given my view - what in your view is the way to proceed? What is the path to "victory" for black people in America? Oh don't get me wrong, I value the expansion of opportunities for Black people. I just don't think that it will cause Whites to look at us differently, at least not to a degree that would really impact society. I don't think it does force them, particularly those who are openly racist, to reconcile their beliefs or actions to reality, it gives them something else to ignore or explain away in making those choices. People's desire to believe something is always more powerful than evidence. I think especially now that the Black community is no longer a physical community, there is no single path to progress. It's about each person doing what he or she can do from the position he or she is in. In spite of the complaints I often hear about a lack of work being done, there are countless organizations and individuals who are committed to a wide spectrum of efforts according to their passions and abilities. I think it is important for these efforts to include finding common ground and learning from one another, and to not put each other down or accept the oppression of one group in the interest of another. When people stop expecting the 60s to come back and sweep them up, and start getting involved where they are, much can be done. |
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