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Post by DamieQue™ on Mar 12, 2008 8:13:52 GMT -5
With so many examples of men in higher office and power eventually abusing that office or power and forgetting their ethics - is there a case to be made that men are victims of the power they attain? Would they otherwise lead upstanding lives if it were not for the power entrusted to them or does opportunity merely draw out character?
Your thoughts?
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Post by kingdelta on Mar 12, 2008 9:11:56 GMT -5
I dont' know if they would lead upstanding lives otherwise but I think the power just gives them more opportunity to act out. I like what you said DeShaun. Opportunity does draw out character. This was just laying dormant until opportunity presented itself.
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Post by Prissy New Year!!! on Mar 12, 2008 9:18:15 GMT -5
I don't think power is a factor. A persons character will eventually tell the tale. The only difference between New York's governor, and RayRay from Brooklyn is the price paid for the p00nanny and the level of public interest when they are caught...
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Post by Bunny Hop on Mar 12, 2008 9:19:26 GMT -5
They aren't victims. They would probably cheat, lie, etc if they were everyday people.
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Post by DamieQue™ on Mar 12, 2008 9:39:25 GMT -5
But in particular with this Elliot Spitzer case for example... as I understand it - he, in the past, crusaded against the very thing he was eventually caught.
Do you all think that the crusade was all an act and he was corrupt to the core, or was he genuine in his approach, but given power, became corrupted?
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Post by Search1906 on Mar 12, 2008 10:17:23 GMT -5
I think he attacked the thing he hated most because he was involved in it and it was a conflict. Tackling the corruptness may have allowed him to make ammends of sorts to himself for his corrupt tendencies. Just a thought. I think your actions under fire show your true character. I think what he did was indicative of who is deep down...someone who struggles with and issue and it came to a head when he got caught. Power gave him more of an opportunity but I think he would have struggled with this even being Joe Smoe because something in him craves what he was doing.
I mean think about it he is the governor of New York and he is paying for trim!! Do you really think there aren't women that would give it for free? I am not advocating it I'm just saying. The whole thought process is crazy. He probably gets off on this kind of thing for whatever reason even though other options were available.
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Post by Cambist on Mar 12, 2008 10:43:02 GMT -5
I also think that we (Americans) are entirely too sanctimonious and it leads people to claim self-righteousness in order to get elected.
We want people without flaws. We want people who have never made mistakes. Those people, i'm sorry to inform you, are not in touch with reality!
People tried to crucify Obama because he smoked. You don't like it? Fine. I don't like people who eat sushi...IT'S RAW fuckIN FISH PEOPLE!!! YOU CAN GET SICK AND DIE! Anyone who takes that kind of unnecessary risk is not fit to govern. Do you agree? I thought not.
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Post by CrimsonENDvy on Mar 12, 2008 11:07:56 GMT -5
What's funny too is that the politicians are quick to "repudiate" the people who get caught...but they're probably doing the same thing themselves.
I was just thinking about that yesterday. I think it's pretty much do what you do, but don't get caught. It's really saddening.
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Post by Nupey on Mar 12, 2008 11:11:20 GMT -5
If you've never had power you will NEVER understand the benefits that come with it...
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Post by kingdelta on Mar 12, 2008 11:16:32 GMT -5
I agree with you Cam. I don't think being a policitican should make you the poster child for morality. I also don't think your past should be held against you. But I do believe that you should practice what you preach once in office. Is that always going to happen? No but it should. Spitzer was NY's top cop. Now he is accused of going against everything he said he stood for. That's the issue I have. Even though I don't think prostitution should be illegal.
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Post by Search1906 on Mar 12, 2008 11:36:22 GMT -5
Cam I think you are right. I think folks set themselves up to fail when they set the moral bar high and know they have skeletons. Its a recipe for disaster/failure.
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Post by Cambist on Mar 12, 2008 11:51:18 GMT -5
I agree with King and Search.
We live in a world where one must claim quasi-divinity in order to be elected. That's why the average man doesn't run for office.
Spitzer...well, I work in the investment industry so I have my own opinion of him....and it's not good. He's a hypocrite, a slimy shakedown artist who abused his power as AG in order to get elected.
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Post by Search1906 on Mar 12, 2008 12:01:48 GMT -5
@ Cam: And the chickens have come home to roost. you can't do dirt and expect it not do air out especially when you've made enemies like he did. He should have been squeeky clean but now look at him. At least the brotha gets a shot to run the show. Hopefully he is up for the task. I gotta research him.
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Post by Bunny Hop on Mar 12, 2008 12:05:29 GMT -5
Isn't there a saying about "the things you hate in others are really the things you hate in yourself" or something like that? The fact that he was on a crusade against prostitution means nothing to me. Maybe he thought that his crusade against prostitution would somehow make him stop what he was doing or somehow right his wrongs..IDK.
Either way he was stupid. Now his wife and two daughters have to put up with all kinds of crap and they will never live it down. I feel sorry for his daughters. What is there opinion of him and men in general now? This man was not just cheating but was paying for the service and her travel across state lines! A mess....
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Post by MochaD on Mar 12, 2008 22:33:54 GMT -5
I also think that we (Americans) are entirely too sanctimonious and it leads people to claim self-righteousness in order to get elected. We want people without flaws. We want people who have never made mistakes. Those people, i'm sorry to inform you, are not in touch with reality! People tried to crucify Obama because he smoked. You don't like it? Fine. I don't like people who eat sushi...IT'S RAW fuckIN FISH PEOPLE!!! YOU CAN GET SICK AND DIE! Anyone who takes that kind of unnecessary risk is not fit to govern. Do you agree? I thought not. That's real talk Cam. For example, I see some church folk hold their Pastors to the HIGHEST regard and think he, the pastor, go home and sit at the table with GOD everynight and come back and tell them what GOD is going to do for them and how GOD is going to bless them so on and so forth...their pastor can do no wrong  That SAME Pastor, at the same time, has women in the congregation knocked up and/or on their knees polishing their holy knobs  -yeah I said it  <---Loves Sushi and eats it weekly! So you don't like me Cam |
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Post by FatalDST on Mar 12, 2008 22:36:08 GMT -5
With so many examples of men in higher office and power eventually abusing that office or power and forgetting their ethics - is there a case to be made that men are victims of the power they attain? Would they otherwise lead upstanding lives if it were not for the power entrusted to them or does opportunity merely draw out character?
Your thoughts? You forgot an option... men AND women can be victims of power... think Pricilla Slade! |
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Post by DamieQue™ on Mar 13, 2008 11:18:43 GMT -5
I'm sure women can be seduced by power too, so I could have made it generic but (as usual) there was another aspect that I was examining beyond just the stated poll.
If you wanted to include her in the bunch though, my question would still be, was that always her character, or did the opportunity corrupt her? Isn't it possible to have the best of intentions but when faced with a temptation you never had before, that you can go weyward?
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Post by Cambist on Mar 13, 2008 11:53:00 GMT -5
@ Mocha...you're good with me. I was just making a point although I do find sushi to be disgusting.
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Post by FatalDST on Mar 13, 2008 12:59:02 GMT -5
I'm sure women can be seduced by power too, so I could have made it generic but (as usual) there was another aspect that I was examining beyond just the stated poll.
If you wanted to include her in the bunch though, my question would still be, was that always her character, or did the opportunity corrupt her? Isn't it possible to have the best of intentions but when faced with a temptation you never had before, that you can go weyward? I think its always oppurtunity... if the situation didnt present itself.. it wouldnt happen. I think most have good intentions when going in and just get caught up. I mean she really helped TSU alot when she started... thats why she ended up in the position... I certainly would hope she didnt go in with ulteria motives |
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Post by DamieQue™ on Mar 13, 2008 13:04:37 GMT -5
Elliot Spitzer cleaned up a lot of corruption on his way to Governor. But I guess we also need to ask HOW he cleaned up things. Did he cut corners to produce results? Was he corrupted by power, or exposed by it... that is the question.
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That SAME Pastor, at the same time, has women in the congregation knocked up and/or on their knees polishing their holy knobs 
-yeah I said it 
"They get two Roos and a snap." ~ perroloco{=}http://s2.images.proboards.com/tongue.gif{/=}{=}http://s2.images.proboards.com/tongue.gif{/=}