I used to be a Kappa

[kaos1906]

Why not, there is nothing tricky in that response unlike when some ask empty or vague at best questions

[Southie]

<<this must be an interesting thread..

[Robelite]

Jul 22, 2008 15:42:24 GMT -5 kaos1906 said:

Why not, there is nothing tricky in that response unlike when some ask empty or vague at best questions

Your question makes perfect sense, frat. That's not the point.

The point is that when faced with a legitimate inquiry, denounce will respond with about 50 passages from the Bible.

OR.....

he'll cut and paste some long, meaningless rhetoric from some strange website that has nothing to do with the question you've asked.

[kaos1906]

Frat, I am well aware of jow they get down (LOL)

[LogAKAlly <3'n Keef]

Dont mind me, I'm just makign sure my name is all over the board...hee hee

[Champs Elysees]

<----------- Used to be a Kappa

*Shimmeys*

[LogAKAlly <3'n Keef]

^^^^

[denounced]

Search- 919/278-8911

kaos- aren't you a Christian? Wowzers!!!!!!

[kaos1906]

Good answer

[what]

Jul 16, 2008 15:57:13 GMT -5 jay0heavenly said:

No where will you find teaching about these Christian principles:

1. The resurrection of Christ
2. The need for every person to be born again (John 3)
3. The indwelling of the Holy Spirit of the Believer
4. Repentance towards salvation
5. Baptism

I typically don't come in the religious threads because I despise pious, judgmental, fanatical so-called ministers of the gospel who typically profit from sowing seeds of non-factual information for personal gain. But I felt compelled to address the fallacy in this post and define exactly what is "Christian Principle".

Huey,et.al if we look at Websters definition of Principle-it states that a "principle is a basic rule or law". If we combine the word principle with the word Christian we clearly see that a Christian principle is simply the laws of Christ. "A comprehensive and fundamental law, doctrine, or assumption that is held by one who professes belief in the teachings of Jesus Christ, and unambiguously establishes the identity of that person (or in the case of this debate: BGLO) to be Christian. "

There is only one set of Christian principles or laws that exists and they are the Ten Commandments. The tenets of Christian principle stem from them.

In Luke 16:17, Jesus says, "It is easier for heaven and earth to pass, then one tittle of the law to fail". "Here, by Christ detailing this minuscule component of the written language (a tittle), it's quite obvious that He had strong feelings about the law -the Ten Commandments. In fact, He zealously stated that Heaven and Earth would pass long before the tiniest part of the law would.

So then, the whole law does remain, But why for the Christian? The answer: for the working of Christ's inner love. Paul wrote, "For all the law is fulfilled in one word, even in this, thou shalt love thy neighbor as thyself" (Gal. 5:14).

Christ intuitively referred to the first five books of the Bible as "the law." Jesus said, "Therefore all things whatsoever you would that men should do to you, do you even so to them: for this is `the law' and the prophets" (Matt. 7:12). Jesus didn't clarify any particular part of the law, but said, "this is the law." Now Jesus meant the whole law is fulfilled or replete in our love toward others (Gal. 5:14), not just part of the law, or part of the prophets. Certainly, then, the Law of God in sum, that is, for the Christian, is none other than our actions toward others! Thus, this is to ". . . establish the law," and in so doing, we "use it lawfully" (1 Tim. 1:8). Indeed, our good behavior toward others is how Christians are to establish the Ten Commandments."

So succinctly put, you my friend,Jay, are wrong.

[what]

You sir are funny, you are confusing Christian Principle which is CLEARLY Christian law as you implied with doctrine. The problem with you fanatical "preachers" so you call yourselves, is that you use doctrine to define what values and beliefs people should believe in to fit what YOU think is what is defined in the Bible. You absolutely CANNOT prove that what you have stated is Christian principle is DOES NOT satisfy the context of the question asked. Instead, you skated around the question asked. Next time, be more specific and stop REACHING to make a point.
There is a difference between doctrine and christian principle. BTW, what theological seminary did you attend?

[what]

Christians who center their doctrine on the written letter of the law, have their focus thwarted from seeing one of God's important purposes of the law, which is for Christians to serve an inner Christ by the use of His inner love. Literally, effective faith functions internally by the use of Christ's inner love, and not by the keeping of the external letter. As Paul fully asserted in the Greek, love in action accomplishes or makes replete the the whole law, including its every holy letter of the Ten Commandments. Undoubtedly, then, Galatians 5:14 takes faith for legalistic Christians to believe.

[Kryptik]

^5 What!

PREACH!!

*Exalt*

[jay0heavenly]

Jul 29, 2008 0:07:45 GMT -5 @what said:

You sir are funny, you are confusing Christian Principle which is CLEARLY Christian law as you implied with doctrine. The problem with you fanatical "preachers" so you call yourselves, is that you use doctrine to define what values and beliefs people should believe in to fit what YOU think is what is defined in the Bible. You absolutely CANNOT prove that what you have stated is Christian principle is DOES NOT satisfy the context of the question asked. Instead, you skated around the question asked. Next time, be more specific and stop REACHING to make a point.
There is a difference between doctrine and christian principle. BTW, what theological seminary did you attend?

I'm finishing up my M.Div at Drew Theological Seminary in NJ.

[jay0heavenly]

Jul 29, 2008 0:21:59 GMT -5 @what said:

Christians who center their doctrine on the written letter of the law, have their focus thwarted from seeing one of God's important purposes of the law, which is for Christians to serve an inner Christ by the use of His inner love. Literally, effective faith functions internally by the use of Christ's inner love, and not by the keeping of the external letter. As Paul fully asserted in the Greek, love in action accomplishes or makes replete the the whole law, including its every holy letter of the Ten Commandments. Undoubtedly, then, Galatians 5:14 takes faith for legalistic Christians to believe.

The focus of the law is this: Galatians 3:24"

"So the law was put in charge to lead us to Christ that we might be justified by faith."

In all of your posts, what is conspicuously missing is any mention of obedience to God, living holy etc, THINGS THAT JESUS TAUGHT ON THE REGULAR!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Hence, its not a hard conclusion to say that Jesus' followers should teach what Jesus taught.

"Repent, for the Kingdom of God is at hand" is one example, but there are many more.

I honestly still have no idea what your argument is centered around...lol. Maybe if you toned down on the pejoratives and actually tried to have a conversation, we could dialog. All I said was that being born again was a Christian Principle, you can argue semantics and call me a "legalist" all day long...

[what]

There is no argument honestly. You just didn't answer the question. The crux of the argument is how greekdom is founded on Christian Principle. Greekdom is founded on the commandments that Jesus held dear which is the greatest two commandments...."to Love God above everything..and love thy neighbor as thyself".

It seems to me, you really don't understand the history behind the founding of greek organizations and why they used the symbols that they did. The founders of most black greek lettered organizations were well versed in greek language and symbolism. Because they were greek scholars, they utilized some of the symbolism to describe the tenets. Ancient greek mythology, I agree, was pagan. However, Christianization took place and "renaissance humanism in Italy and western Europe included the rediscovery and reintroduction of the culture and learning of ancient Greek thought and philosophy, which included a renewed appreciation of the ancient religion and myth, reinterpreted from a humanist point-of-view.". Scholars of these BGLO's understood that and christianization had to happen.

All greekdom has pomp and circumstance..greek rhetoric so to speak. When greekdom was formed it was modeled after white sororities. The intention was to mimic those organizations because it was a time when only 1/3 of 1% of African Americans and 5% of whites of eligible age attended any college and they wanted to reflect college life found on white college campuses ;not only that, but to also foster a network of the "talented tenth" into black society. It's obvious that you have not studied the founders of the orgs and why they chose the symbolisms they chose. In those days Blacks had to assimulate into white society and understand the undercurrent of the good ol' boy network particularly Masonary. Our country was founded on it and blacks needed ways to utilize it...to use it as a footstool to get into American society. If you really want to attack any organization try masonary---good luck! lol I digress.

You cannot prove that being born again is a Christian Principle....that's doctrine period. If so, please show me the scripture that supports that fact. I can't help that you feel belittled from my so called dyslogistic commentary. It just shows that you simply have not researched nor do you understand or maybe you don't know the Bible as well as you profess. You can call it semantics but the word of God is true, you cannot use the Word to make generalizations to support ill thought out posts. That would make you a false prophet. I would think that someone getting their Masters in Theology would have done a better job of understanding ancient religious societies. I imagine, from your posts, you chose to ignore them. Study harder for the A.

You always admire what you really don't understand.
~Blaise Pascal

[jay0heavenly]

You cannot prove that being born again is a Christian Principle....that's doctrine period. If so, please show me the scripture that supports that fact.

John 3:3 "Jesus answered and said to him, "Truly, truly, I say to you, unless one is born again he cannot see the kingdom of God."

Jesus Christ said that you have to be born again...hence it is a Christian principle...

In one of your above posts...you define a principle as "principle is a basic rule or law". Here's a basic rule for you..."Truly, I say to you, you must be born again". Accordingly this is a PRIN-CI-PAL of Christ...hence a Christian Principle.

I won't stoop to the level of name calling or insults... so I'll just jump off this boat right now since I see it heading head first towards crashing bad.

[what]

Jul 29, 2008 13:22:53 GMT -5 jay0heavenly said:

You cannot prove that being born again is a Christian Principle....that's doctrine period. If so, please show me the scripture that supports that fact.

John 3:3 "Jesus answered and said to him, "Truly, truly, I say to you, unless one is born again he cannot see the kingdom of God."

Jesus Christ said that you have to be born again...hence it is a Christian principle...

In one of your above posts...you define a principle as "principle is a basic rule or law". Here's a basic rule for you..."Truly, I say to you, you must be born again". Accordingly this is a PRIN-CI-PAL of Christ...hence a Christian Principle.

I won't stoop to the level of name calling or insults... so I'll just jump off this boat right now since I see it heading head first towards crashing bad.

hahhaha Oh dear Jay, I am not name calling, but I am calling out overzealous- wanna be- Bible- toting -preachers who misuse the Word to satisfy personal beliefs. I cannot blame you because you are yet still young and do not understand. I can tell you get a lot of information secondhand and present it as fact. The only true information is the Bible scriptures you quote. Just study harder babe.
Anywho, glad you pointed that (john 3:3) out. In order to understand you MUST read what was said before.

Jhn 3:1 ¶ There was a man of the Pharisees, named Nicodemus, a ruler of the Jews:


Jhn 3:2 The same came to Jesus by night, and said unto him, Rabbi, we know that thou art a teacher come from God: for no man can do these miracles that thou doest, except God be with him.


Jhn 3:3 Jesus answered and said unto him, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born again, he cannot see the kingdom of God.

The Pharisees were a group of people known for being hypocrites (a lot in this thread lol) and were intensely jealous of Jesus though Nicodemus was curious about his views and was searching for answers. Jesus, being a teacher himself, showed him and us that any person with an open mind and heart can learn the truth about God. Nicodemus knew nothing about the kingdom;he was a Pharisee but he needed to understand salvation is offered to the whole world not just a part of it namely the Jews and he needed to be born again. Once again this is a doctrine not a principle.

Besides,to further understand John 3:3, you must read Luke 17:20,21when the Pharisees inquired about the coming of God's kingdom. He was teaching what is Christian doctrine not law or principle. The ONLY laws Jesus Christ used as his directives were the Ten Commandments....his divine instructions. If this is regarded as the laws of Christ then this lends itself to superceding God's word which Christ never did.

[Search1906]

I really want to jump in this but at this point I don't have the time to say what I want and due it justice. I will say that someone posting is a little off in their assessment.

I'll be back though....

[jay0heavenly]

The ONLY laws Jesus Christ used as his directives were the Ten Commandments....his divine instructions. If this is regarded as the laws of Christ then this lends itself to superceding God's word which Christ never did.

Your misunderstanding what I said. The crux of this argument is what is a Christian Principle. Not what are the laws from which Jesus deduced his teachings.

To me personally, Christianity extends beyond the 10 commandments and the law. Christianity or as it was called, "the way" began as a radical sect of jews which exploded to what we have today. MANY "Christian" Principles were put in place after the death and resurrection of Christ and were governing the way in which believers acted in the first century. You simply cannot ignore the letters and the gospel teachings and dismiss them as not being principles since they were the only rules and laws by which the Church lived by.

Eating meat for example...The law said not to, but we are not under the law, but under grace, so we can eat whatever meat we want to. Acts 10, 1 Tim 6 etc. The law has one principle, first century Christianity has another. Neither are conflicting because they must both be understood contextually.

To you it may seem that we need only worry about the 10 commandments and since you brought it up I'll quote it for you.

Exo 20:3 "You shall have no other gods before Me.
Exo 20:4 "You shall not make for yourself an idol, or any likeness of what is in heaven above or on the earth beneath or in the water under the earth.
Exo 20:5 "You shall not worship them or serve them; for I, the LORD your God, am a jealous God, visiting the iniquity of the fathers on the children, on the third and the fourth generations of those who hate Me"

I wonder what Idol your sorority is associated with How do you think our Jealous God feels about that?

[jay0heavenly]

Also, one more point, you noted that Jesus stated the greatest commandments are to Love God 1st and love your neighbor 2nd.

Jesus stated in John, "If you love me you will obey my commandments". There's no love without obedience to God's word. Thats a principle right there. OBEDIENCE to God is THE MOST IMPORTANT THING!!! YOU CANNOT LOVE GOD WITHOUT OBEYING WHAT HE'S SAYING TO DO! Please don't leave that out.

AND, more importantly, God's way of life for us extends FAR beyond being kind to your neighbor. It mandates us to live HOLY, faith filled lives that are pleasing to God.

Here's a LAW from the OT to back that up home skillet

Lev 11:45 'For I am the LORD who brought you up from the land of Egypt to be your God; thus you shall be holy, for I am holy."

Is this Christian principle in greekdom? No maam it is not.

[what]

To me personally, Christianity extends beyond the 10 commandments and the law.

Key word:personal..once again, not scripture....not fact.

I wonder what Idol your sorority is associated with How do you think our Jealous God feels about that?

I am not in a sorority hun. At this point, I don't desire to join one either. I don't join sides, I just look at things objectively. I've read your "rituals" you've posted and for a moment I was convinced you may be on to something. But then, I really read for myself, I feel you need to do the same. I am not here to convince you or anyone else to join a BGLO--your personal beliefs are just that--yours.

However, I don't agree with "preachers" who try to use 1 or 2 scriptures to pick at something they don't understand. If you don't understand, why not ask? Or maybe you have and made conclusions based on boxed facts. It's apparent that these so-called denouncers were never taught properly their organizational history nor are they remotely in touch with black history, American history, or ancient Greek/Christian history. To explain to you without countless hours of posting would be too numerous.

One thing about GREAT theologians is that their researching is relentless, they examine every facet of religion and explore. You, water, and denounce have yet to do that. I feel that's simply because your personal faith (more than likely Apostolic/Pentecostal) refuses to expand your knowledge base. So when it comes to greekdom/religion you sir are, IMHO, are ill-equipped.

In addition, your second post regarding Leviticus, you must first understand the HISTORY of Leviticus--you are a grad student, you should know this.

Leviticus was a handbook for the priests and Levites outlining their duties in worship and a guidebook of holy living for the Hebrews. God was teaching the Israelites how to live as holy people. The verse you chose is particularly unique because God wanted his people to be holy that's why he called them out of an idolatrous nation (Egypt).

What you should have noted is Habakkuk 1:11 which addresses the essence of idolatry--asking the gods a person makes to get help them get all they want. The essence of Christianity is asking God who made us to give all we can in service to him. BGLO's do perform a service to mankind--the essence of Christianity.

The only pagan symbols(as you define it) still used today are found in certain shields of BGLO's but those same paganist emblems are found in money, law, and education to name a few. You utilize them all so does that mean you are idolatrous too?

[what]

The emblems found in law, money, and the likes are meant to represent something particular. When you begin to WORSHIP idolatrous things such as money, etc. to forsake all others is when it becomes a sin.

[jay0heavenly]

The essence of Christianity is asking God who made us to give all we can in service to him. BGLO's do perform a service to mankind--the essence of Chrisitanity.

The essence of Christianity is to redeem a sinful world back to right relationship with God. End of story.

You wanna hear why Jesus came to earth? 1st Timothy 1:15
"It is a trustworthy statement, deserving full acceptance, that Christ Jesus came into the world to save sinners, among whom I am foremost of all."

It has absolutely nothing to do with community service. Mormons, Jehovah's Witnesses, Buddhists et. al ALL do community service. That alone means absolutely nothing.

I'm done casting my pearls among swine...you are obviously determined to win an argument, (one in which you have absolutely no legs to stand). I should have listened to Proverbs a loooooooooooooong time ago and stop answering your posts.

Have a nice time arguing with yourself home skillet.

[what]

Jul 30, 2008 14:20:53 GMT -5 jay0heavenly said:

The essence of Christianity is asking God who made us to give all we can in service to him. BGLO's do perform a service to mankind--the essence of Chrisitanity.

The essence of Christianity is to redeem a sinful world back to right relationship with God. End of story.

You wanna hear why Jesus came to earth? 1st Timothy 1:15
"It is a trustworthy statement, deserving full acceptance, that Christ Jesus came into the world to save sinners, among whom I am foremost of all."

It has absolutely nothing to do with community service. Mormons, Jehovah's Witnesses, Buddhists et. al ALL do community service. That alone means absolutely nothing.

I'm done casting my pearls among swine...you are obviously determined to win an argument, (one in which you have absolutely no legs to stand). I should have listened to Proverbs a loooooooooooooong time ago and stop answering your posts.

Have a nice time arguing with yourself home skillet.

That's funny, I didn't make up that statement, it came STRAIGHT from the Bible. The essence of Christianity and the essence of Christ is synonomous yet different. To sum up Christ in one statement is too difficult. I could give you Scriptures as to why you should not judge and how that's a sin but I would imagine that you don't feel you're that sinful. How can you question one's relationship with God or their intention. Who are you to judge? Every man/woman will be held accountabe for themselves....like I said before study harder.

You chose to give up because you have no real knowledge base. I've met homegrown ministers like you, you feed off of heresay and hypocrisy. You fear what you don't understand.

I've noticed that when you have been backed into a corner in which you can not win, you try to end with a random quote from the Bible which still does not justify your argument and then resort to how you are seemingly superior because you think you've got it right. How pious!

My dialogue with you is FAR from an argument....you obviously don't know "what". No need for name calling though, I am not a piglet or even a niglet. lol But I will keep the pearls.

oh yeah, thanks for the smite...checkmate!

[what]

Additionally, If you read the preceeding verses of Timothy, it states...

Unto Timothy, [my] own son in the faith: Grace, mercy, [and] peace, from God our Father and Jesus Christ our Lord.


1Ti 1:3 ¶ As I besought thee to abide still at Ephesus, when I went into Macedonia, that thou mightest charge some that they teach no other doctrine,


1Ti 1:4 Neither give heed to fables and endless genealogies, which minister questions, rather than godly edifying which is in faith: [so do].


1Ti 1:5 Now the end of the commandment is charity out of a pure heart, and [of] a good conscience, and [of] faith unfeigned:


1Ti 1:6 From which some having swerved have turned aside unto vain jangling;


1Ti 1:7 Desiring to be teachers of the law; understanding neither what they say, nor whereof they affirm.


1Ti 1:8 But we know that the law [is] good, if a man use it lawfully;


1Ti 1:9 Knowing this, that the law is not made for a righteous man, but for the lawless and disobedient, for the ungodly and for sinners, for unholy and profane, for murderers of fathers and murderers of mothers, for manslayers,


1Ti 1:10 For whoremongers, for them that defile themselves with mankind, for menstealers, for liars, for perjured persons, and if there be any other thing that is contrary to sound doctrine;


1Ti 1:11 According to the glorious gospel of the blessed God, which was committed to my trust.


1Ti 1:12 ¶ And I thank Christ Jesus our Lord, who hath enabled me, for that he counted me faithful, putting me into the ministry;


1Ti 1:13 Who was before a blasphemer, and a persecutor, and injurious: but I obtained mercy, because I did [it] ignorantly in unbelief.


1Ti 1:14 And the grace of our Lord was exceeding abundant with faith and love which is in Christ Jesus.


1Ti 1:15 This [is] a faithful saying, and worthy of all acceptation, that Christ Jesus came into the world to save sinners; of whom I am chief.

This is service to HIM---the essence of CHRISTIANITY.

Home fry!

[Mrs. Eyes]

Well.....................damn! EXHALT!

[water]

[denounced]

Jay, did a little research. I will hit you up today.