Odd Topic: His Death or His Resurrection

[Chal™]

I was recently involved in an odd conversation with 2 people and basically, the disagreement was this:

Person 1 "argues" that Jesus' death is what wash us clean from the "debt of sin" and that even if He had not arisen on that third day, the deed was done, the sacrifice was made, and that as our "debt" was paid. Their words: The glory was His dying, not His living again."

Person 2 "argues" that Jesus being brought back to life is what completes the deed and that without that part, the sacrifice is null and void. Their words: His death is a symbol. He died in a world of sin, and rose again to live with God in heaven.

What say you?

[Cambist]

I wouldn't say that the resurrection is not important but I would argue that the crucifiction itself is the miracle of Christ's death.

[denounced]

Both are necessary to be believed, so therefore both occurrences had to have happened for them to be worth anything.

[peppermint]

While both had to occur, I personally believe in the resurrection. Had He not resurrected, He would have been matyr, not Savior.

[Chal™]

can you explain that, Pep?

[dhype]

Aug 3, 2010 15:06:35 GMT -5 peppermint said:

While both had to occur, I personally believe in the resurrection. Had He not resurrected, He would have been matyr, not Savior.

I agree, others have died in God's name but It was Jesus' ability to resurrect that separated him.

[LejaOMG]

At first blush, I would've said the death. Because Jesus' perfect life was given in exchange for perfect life that Adam lost. But now that I think about it, it's both. Here's why: God's original prophecy concerning Jesus' sacrifice was as follows, " And I shall put enmity between you and the woman and between your seed and her seed. He will bruise you in the head and you will bruise him in the heel.” (Genesis 3:15)

This basically means that Jesus (the woman's seed) was going to permanently destroy sin and death (Satan's seed) thereby "bruising him in the head." Satan, in turn was going to destroy Jesus only temporarily (which is why Jesus was only bruised in the heel), i.e. he died and rose again.

Had Jesus not been resurrected (thereby rendering Jesus' bruise permanent), the prophecy would not have been fulfilled. And then Jesus' death, though sacrificial, would not have technically been propitiatory. (aside from the prophetic feature that Jesus himself will be leading the war against the devil and were he not resurrected, this would obviously be impossible) That is, it would not necessarily have sufficed to set the prophecy in motion that eventually leads to Jesus' eradicating sin and death.

[InMyWorld]

Aug 3, 2010 20:17:10 GMT -5 dhype said:

Aug 3, 2010 15:06:35 GMT -5 peppermint said:

While both had to occur, I personally believe in the resurrection. Had He not resurrected, He would have been matyr, not Savior.

I agree, others have died in God's name but It was Jesus' ability to resurrect that separated him.

The truth!

[NOLA Darling]

I think his death cleanses us of our sins. His resurrection gives us our faith and is what makes us believe in everlasting life...overcoming death and being with God and the righteous on the "other side"...victory in death. Faith tells us that he rose from the dead and is seated at the right hand of the Father. I think you may be talking about two different things.

[Chal™]

thanks, folks

PS:

Yall know I'm gonna use all this, right? lol

[ReignMan19]

its the ooa way... lol

[**Dea**]

lol!

BP said everything I was thinking for the most part