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Post by LejaOMG on Oct 16, 2009 13:39:02 GMT -5
My comment about the 144,000 was that I as well as many people do not understand where that number originated... (is it in the Bible???) Quite so. Revelation 14:1 |
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Post by Chal™ on Oct 16, 2009 13:59:30 GMT -5
comment about the 144,000 was that I as well as many people do not understand where that number originated. I realize that it is a JW belief which is why I mentioned it. I was saying that it is confusing and a turn-off to mention such a specific number about who is going to heaven (is it in the Bible???) and not be able to explain where the number came from. I am familiar with the JW belief that the "others" will be in an earthly paradise as you mentioned. That specific number IS in the Bible. Leja provided the scripture above. I think the issue with this is that a lot of churches focus on Heaven and Hell. No middle ground. They don't point out that everyone isn't going to heaven. It's always, "And when I get to Heaven.........." And like when people die, someone always says, "He/She is in a better place." What place? There is no place. The soul leaves the body and waits for judgement day. You don't die and go to Heaven or Hell. It is those kinds of teachings that make me look other places for knowledge and understanding. Awww, not a problem. I love a good banter every now and then. lol |
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Post by 123Diva on Oct 16, 2009 17:59:08 GMT -5
My comment about the 144,000 was that I as well as many people do not understand where that number originated... (is it in the Bible???) Quite so. Revelation 14:1 I will check it out. Thx. |
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Post by 123Diva on Oct 16, 2009 18:14:41 GMT -5
Okay, so I checked it out, and of course with most things, it's all a matter of interpretation. This was not the 1st time I came across this verse in Revelation, but I have never understood it to mean that ONLY those 144,000 people would be in heaven with Christ. Be back with more later...
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Post by nsync on Oct 18, 2009 17:39:12 GMT -5
But aren't they still Christians? Jehovah's witnesses do not believe Jesus equal to God as Christian's do. They believe he is a creation of Jehovah and at one point was Michael the arch angel. They do believe he was a perfect man. |
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Post by nsync on Oct 18, 2009 17:49:29 GMT -5
Where exactly does the soul wait , as you believe it, in purgatory...limbo? Curious. comment about the 144,000 was that I as well as many people do not understand where that number originated. I realize that it is a JW belief which is why I mentioned it. I was saying that it is confusing and a turn-off to mention such a specific number about who is going to heaven (is it in the Bible???) and not be able to explain where the number came from. I am familiar with the JW belief that the "others" will be in an earthly paradise as you mentioned. That specific number IS in the Bible. Leja provided the scripture above. I think the issue with this is that a lot of churches focus on Heaven and Hell. No middle ground. They don't point out that everyone isn't going to heaven. It's always, "And when I get to Heaven.........." And like when people die, someone always says, "He/She is in a better place." What place? There is no place. The soul leaves the body and waits for judgement day. You don't die and go to Heaven or Hell. It is those kinds of teachings that make me look other places for knowledge and understanding. Awww, not a problem. I love a good banter every now and then. lol |
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Post by Chal™ on Oct 19, 2009 10:46:47 GMT -5
my interpretation of Purgatory is hell, so no, i don't believe it is there. It just is. I leaves the body and just waits. i don't say that to mean it roams the Earth all willy nilly. I simply believe in Judgement Day. Until then, the soul just is.
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Post by LejaOMG on Oct 20, 2009 15:02:49 GMT -5
Where exactly does the soul wait , as you believe it, in purgatory...limbo? Curious. I know you weren't asking me, but I have an answer. I don't believe that the "soul" (as most Christians understand the term) and the body are separate. Afterall, when God created Adam he did not "give" him a soul, but "he became a living soul" Genesis 2:7. The testament also says "the soul that is sinning, it itself will die." Ezekiel 18:4. So when we die, both our body and our life force extinguish. "And in that day, [our] thoughts do perish." Where do humans go while they await resurrection? The grave, also called Sheol or Hades. The same place Jesus' body was while it awaited resurrection. I believe that both "purgatory" and "limbo" are concepts borrowed from Greek philosophy that were injected into Christian practices by Augustine and other Neoplatonists. I can provide sources if you care. |
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Post by peppermint on Oct 31, 2009 9:19:46 GMT -5
One is at my door right now! I'm carefully watching through the window to see if she leaves materials
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Post by Chal™ on Nov 2, 2009 14:48:41 GMT -5
Why not just open the door and say hello?
<--- is leaving this thread right now trying to accept the ways of the world, yet shaking my darn head.
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Post by peppermint on Nov 2, 2009 21:40:02 GMT -5
^^^Because the last time I did so to politely decline the Watchtower, they stood there for 8 minutes trying to convince me otherwise.Why come to my home and ask to discuss the Bible but not be willing to discuss my Bible? Why hand me one of your devotionals but not be willing to accept one of mine? I'm not going to be rude and slam the door in their face s so I've stopped answering the door.
P.S.- No materials were left
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Post by nsync on Nov 19, 2009 22:38:07 GMT -5
Thank you. my interpretation of Purgatory is hell, so no, i don't believe it is there. It just is. I leaves the body and just waits. i don't say that to mean it roams the Earth all willy nilly. I simply believe in Judgement Day. Until then, the soul just is. |
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Post by nsync on Nov 19, 2009 22:39:54 GMT -5
Wow this is awesome...like seriously....a dead period before judgement. Never heard of it that way before. Either deadend forever or straight to heaven or hell. Where exactly does the soul wait , as you believe it, in purgatory...limbo? Curious. I know you weren't asking me, but I have an answer. I don't believe that the "soul" (as most Christians understand the term) and the body are separate. Afterall, when God created Adam he did not "give" him a soul, but "he became a living soul" Genesis 2:7. The testament also says "the soul that is sinning, it itself will die." Ezekiel 18:4. So when we die, both our body and our life force extinguish. "And in that day, [our] thoughts do perish." Where do humans go while they await resurrection? The grave, also called Sheol or Hades. The same place Jesus' body was while it awaited resurrection. I believe that both "purgatory" and "limbo" are concepts borrowed from Greek philosophy that were injected into Christian practices by Augustine and other Neoplatonists. I can provide sources if you care. |
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