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Post by DamieQue™ on Jul 8, 2009 16:00:04 GMT -5
While I would agree with there being a very slim chance of actually getting information from someone in that chapter, getting info from a member of that particular orgnaization is great. Also, there is a great chance that you will get a more realistic view of what it's like to be in an organization and what to expect from the internet than from asking those in the chapter who aren't inclined to tell you shit. That's just how it is. Plus, why would you even CONSIDER someone who hadn't exhausted all possible resources to find out what they wanted to know? Even if they are wrong and end up paying for it later....you want someone who is not thorough?
Here's what you have a great chance of obtaining by polling people on the internet who don't know you, your situation, or your journey - a belief that you understand what to expect from members of all chapters. My goodness... there hasn't even been consensus on THIS board about something as simple as the validity of a pledge process. If an interest is listening to Cam and Iceman - he'd get 2 polar opposite views... now which one should he listen to?
Exactly. |
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Post by juschill on Jul 8, 2009 18:10:21 GMT -5
:cough cough:
so i was kinder thinking about this today...and alot of you good ppl are talking about the "spoon fed" generation of greek aspirants, and I do agree alot do act that way, however one would have to be privy to this culture beforehand to even know this. now of course you shouldn't expect be to GIVEN anything in life, but "greek life" really isnt as "duuuh" as people think
so how does a freshman starting college who has absolutely NO CLUE about anything regarding greeks go about "properly" seeking information about XYZ org, or asking this and that question. if that person didnt know any better, of course they would apply what they feel is "appropriate" measures to the circumstances. we use the internet for research, so why would an aspirant (once again, never been introduced to anything greek) realize that using the internet to research their org of choice is frowned upon?
you will eventually learn through time the "do's and don'ts", but thats only with trial and error. but if someone is still going through the "trial" session... =/
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Post by greatvalue on Jul 9, 2009 7:34:23 GMT -5
*still feeling like the asshole today* Y'all don't realize that this is a new era with a new mindsets. The aspirants are privy to more information than most older members. They have both the good and the bad info....they're better informed. Also, young people are different. The last generation and a half are all about "what can you do for me"? They use the fact that society has become almost exclusively hedonistic and individualistic to base their decisions. Including what organizations they join. I'll be honest, any aspirant who doesn't feel that the organization "needs them" in some way will not be a strong candidate. Most of us shun this arrogance....I embrace a healthy amount of it. Truth is people don't come to our organizations in the same condition they used to, they already possess a greater basket of knowledge, they have a lessened sense of loyalty to principles and ON principles......they are different. Despite that difference, we are attempting to continue business as usual and expect things to go as they always have. I'm not saying that we should lower our standards....not at all. I'm just saying that we have to decide whether we are using criteria for a sheep to evaluate a hog. a hog?!?!?!?!?!?! LOL. =D |
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Post by greatvalue on Jul 9, 2009 7:40:00 GMT -5
While I would agree with there being a very slim chance of actually getting information from someone in that chapter, getting info from a member of that particular orgnaization is great. Also, there is a great chance that you will get a more realistic view of what it's like to be in an organization and what to expect from the internet than from asking those in the chapter who aren't inclined to tell you shit. That's just how it is. Plus, why would you even CONSIDER someone who hadn't exhausted all possible resources to find out what they wanted to know? Even if they are wrong and end up paying for it later....you want someone who is not thorough?
Here's what you have a great chance of obtaining by polling people on the internet who don't know you, your situation, or your journey - a belief that you understand what to expect from members of all chapters. My goodness... there hasn't even been consensus on THIS board about something as simple as the validity of a pledge process. If an interest is listening to Cam and Iceman - he'd get 2 polar opposite views... now which one should he listen to?
Exactly. .....Neither! He recognizes the validity some of the points but continues to know that the only true research he can do is on the national website and in the books ..... If I asked a question only to try to live by everyone's answers I would be an IDIOT! Peoples answers do help to open your eyes to different schools of thought, but they are by no means substitutes for valid research. |
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Post by FatalDST on Jul 9, 2009 8:11:06 GMT -5
:cough cough: so i was kinder thinking about this today...and alot of you good ppl are talking about the "spoon fed" generation of greek aspirants, and I do agree alot do act that way, however one would have to be privy to this culture beforehand to even know this. now of course you shouldn't expect be to GIVEN anything in life, but "greek life" really isnt as "duuuh" as people think so how does a freshman starting college who has absolutely NO CLUE about anything regarding greeks go about "properly" seeking information about XYZ org, or asking this and that question. if that person didnt know any better, of course they would apply what they feel is "appropriate" measures to the circumstances. we use the internet for research, so why would an aspirant (once again, never been introduced to anything greek) realize that using the internet to research their org of choice is frowned upon? you will eventually learn through time the "do's and don'ts", but thats only with trial and error. but if someone is still going through the "trial" session... =/ First thing you do is go to events, you can see the kind of people who attend these events, and peep the atmosphere. Second, you look up whatever information you can find on the group and reserch past history (national and the chapter on campus) , members, current evets, programs, etc. Thirdly, you find you arent eligible as a freshman anyway, so you continue you do 1 and 2 and focus on your studies until you are eligible! If you do #1 enough, you will eventually start communicating with other interests and maybe even get to know members of the chapter on campus.... |
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Post by Cambist on Jul 9, 2009 9:20:10 GMT -5
@ Damie
We've just established that an aspirant can only expect to get a "Do your research", "Go with the flow" or some other vague answer to most questions they have about greek life if they ask a member of that chapter. And rightfully so. Who wants to spoil the fun. The effect of ritual and process is 90% surprise.
Having said that, gathering as much information as possible is the only rational choice for those who really take the general advice of the chapter members: "Do your research."
As greatvalue said, take it all in and take none of it to heart. Just have it as a basis of knowledge.
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Post by DamieQue™ on Jul 9, 2009 10:19:24 GMT -5
Cam, if you are seeking membership into a certain chapter - who better to ask than members of that chapter? Why would I consider someone who doesn't even do that?
Here's what you have a great chance of obtaining by polling people on the internet who don't know you, your situation, or your journey - a belief that you understand what to expect from members of all chapters. My goodness... there hasn't even been consensus on THIS board about something as simple as the validity of a pledge process. If an interest is listening to Cam and Iceman - he'd get 2 polar opposite views... now which one should he listen to?
Exactly. .....continues to know that the only true research he can do is on the national website and in the books .....
In closing if you are learning anything from this anonymous Q&A session learn this:
1. You are on a message board - and few people take kindly to a cold question out of the blue - it has NOTHING to do with being Greek. I speak first hand on this having witnessed the same phenomena a music message board, a political message board, and a gaming message board. Hopefully your entry here is not an example of your social skill/graces otherwise you have alot more to worry about then when Greeks were pursuing
2. There are plenty of people on this board who WEREN'T greek when they first joined, who came in and became a part of the community - and THEN asked questions (publically and privately) who I am certain have gotten both more positive and more useful guidance than what you believe you are getting right now.
3. There is a difference between just valid research vs. pertinent research and that has been my point all along. You can do valid research (here and other places) that won't be pertinent at all. But get it how you want it playa - if you think this is helping you who am I to say otherwise. Best of luck either way. |
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Post by Mrs. Eyes on Jul 9, 2009 11:07:03 GMT -5
Pretty much, case and point, don't expect us Greeks to hold your hand while you are in your pursuit. We didn't have that priviledge.
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Post by Julie Art on Jul 9, 2009 11:29:35 GMT -5
While I would agree with there being a very slim chance of actually getting information from someone in that chapter, getting info from a member of that particular orgnaization is great. Also, there is a great chance that you will get a more realistic view of what it's like to be in an organization and what to expect from the internet than from asking those in the chapter who aren't inclined to tell you shit. That's just how it is. Plus, why would you even CONSIDER someone who hadn't exhausted all possible resources to find out what they wanted to know? Even if they are wrong and end up paying for it later....you want someone who is not thorough? On information, yes. On individual interaction and experience? The only research for that is to experience, it period. No ifs, ands, or buts about it. I'm sorry Cam, but you are reaching. |
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Post by Julie Art on Jul 9, 2009 11:30:47 GMT -5
I see greek orgs. as a great analogy of the real world. Aspirants come to members, expecting to get spoon fed as they have for so long, when most greeks tell them hayle naw, you gotta do this ish yourself, then they go into the whoa is me story, why ya'll being so mean, etc. The world is mean, deal with it. I was thinking this all along, Juicy. LIFE is a "game". The same stuff you have to do to seek membership in a BGLO, you are gonna have to do for a WHOLE LOTTA other things. Most def! Your job/career is one that speaks volumes in the game that has to be played. Get over it. |
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Post by Julie Art on Jul 9, 2009 11:31:20 GMT -5
While I would agree with there being a very slim chance of actually getting information from someone in that chapter, getting info from a member of that particular orgnaization is great. Also, there is a great chance that you will get a more realistic view of what it's like to be in an organization and what to expect from the internet than from asking those in the chapter who aren't inclined to tell you shit. That's just how it is. Plus, why would you even CONSIDER someone who hadn't exhausted all possible resources to find out what they wanted to know? Even if they are wrong and end up paying for it later....you want someone who is not thorough?
Here's what you have a great chance of obtaining by polling people on the internet who don't know you, your situation, or your journey - a belief that you understand what to expect from members of all chapters. My goodness... there hasn't even been consensus on THIS board about something as simple as the validity of a pledge process. If an interest is listening to Cam and Iceman - he'd get 2 polar opposite views... now which one should he listen to?
Exactly. Exhalt |
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Post by Cambist on Jul 9, 2009 11:51:04 GMT -5
I'm not saying that you can gain some kind of magic aspirant password that will help you get in the good graces of the organizations members. We all know that's not possible.
What I AM saying is that everyone always says, "Do your research". What does that include? Do you know? Are they supposed to know?
If you were going to an interview for a new job with a company you don't know much about are you going to just look at their web page? If you answer yes then good luck should you ever run into a good interviewer.
If you are going to pursue membership, the game is what it is. That doesn't mean you shouldn't look for all the information you can possibly get that may help you out.
Yes, there is such a thing as a know it all (I KNOW this first hand) but in the long run, and as long as you're not a pompus show off, it helps.
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Post by T-Rex91 on Jul 9, 2009 12:08:03 GMT -5
I'm sorry Cam, if you're looking for me to tell you to read the public published history book of whatever org you're interested in, support some campus events, and form some friendships as a start, I may as well tell you how to tie your shoelaces and keep your fly zipped. And if you don't know anyone in the org that you can confidentially ask your questions, who the heck is going to recommend you/write your letter? It's moot at that point. At least in my eyes, you had better not come asking me for a letter if I just met you.
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Post by Julie Art on Jul 9, 2009 12:18:48 GMT -5
Thank you '91. As for do your research, for me, if you are a college student, "do your research" should not be a foreign word to a the aspirant, nor should I have to spell out to you how to do it. That goes for grad aspirants as well. You got a degree, you should know what "do your research" means and what that encompasses. If you do not, then the last thing you should be thinking about is joining a grad cha[ter and figure out more what is up with the college you are attending, or graduted from.
Telling someone what it means to "do your research" is spoon feeding, period.
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Post by DamieQue™ on Jul 9, 2009 12:22:11 GMT -5
I'm not saying that you can gain some kind of magic aspirant password that will help you get in the good graces of the organizations members. We all know that's not possible. What I AM saying is that everyone always says, "Do your research". What does that include? Do you know? Are they supposed to know? If you were going to an interview for a new job with a company you don't know much about are you going to just look at their web page? If you answer yes then good luck should you ever run into a good interviewer.
I mean they're employed so I guess it's valid research but is it pertinent research? |
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Post by Julie Art on Jul 9, 2009 12:25:46 GMT -5
I'm sorry Cam, if you're looking for me to tell you to read the public published history book of whatever org you're interested in, support some campus events, and form some friendships as a start, I may as well tell you how to tie your shoelaces and keep your fly zipped. And if you don't know anyone in the org that you can confidentially ask your questions, who the heck is going to recommend you/write your letter? It's moot at that point. At least in my eyes, you had better not come asking me for a letter if I just met you. and who is going to vote for? I'm not voting for someone that if I haven't heard of, at least my sorors has and can give a character assesment. Lets be real. Then also, I think it's also moot for an aspirant to be on a message board asking questions about whatever because for all that aspirant know, they are trying to go undergrad, and every person they are talking too on the board could have gone grad, and we all know (well, at least some of us) that seeking membership through undegrad is a WHOLE lot different then grad and vice versa. It's a whole other horse. And then you got folks who went grad trying to give advice to someone else on how to go ugrad and that makes a bigger mess. That is why I say, talk to someone who you know, or know of in the org., instead of getting on the interent for questions such as the one that was originally given. |
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Post by T-Rex91 on Jul 9, 2009 12:27:10 GMT -5
Agrees with Juicy 10000%. Though Delta's numbers betray the fact  , sorority/fraternity life is not a right of college, it's a perk. It's a priviledge that should be limited to the best and the brightest. Just because you want it, doesn't mean you should get it. It should be sought after and earned and common sense is a really good trait in an applicant. Some of the reason that aspirants get the responses they do is because they are asking "common sense" questions. Thousands of us were able to figure this out without "cyber coaches", why can't you? |
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Post by icebraka on Jul 9, 2009 12:27:34 GMT -5
<------doing the crip walk on this thread
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Post by Julie Art on Jul 9, 2009 12:29:56 GMT -5
Agrees with Juicy 10000%. Though Delta's numbers betray the fact , sorority/fraternity life is not a right of college, it's a perk. It's a priviledge that should be limited to the best and the brightest. Just because you want it, doesn't mean you should get it. It should be sought after and earned and common sense is a really good trait in an applicant. Some of the reason that aspirants get the responses they do is because they are asking "common sense" questions. Thousands of us were able to figure this out without "cyber coaches", why can't you? Amen! From 1906 all the way up to when message boards started popping. When was that, like early 2000? Maybe like 2002? How many had become members in that time frame without the internet? TONS! And like '91 said, alot of these folks think that just because they want to be a member, that they should have automatic membership. Not so. I want a BMW, but just because I want one doesn't mean I will automatically get it. I'mma have to work and save for it. Such is BGLOs, such is life! |
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Post by DamieQue™ on Jul 9, 2009 12:32:48 GMT -5
Agrees with Juicy 10000%. Though Delta's numbers betray the fact , sorority/fraternity life is not a right of college, it's a perk. It's a priviledge that should be limited to the best and the brightest. Just because you want it, doesn't mean you should get it. It should be sought after and earned and common sense is a really good trait in an applicant. Some of the reason that aspirants get the responses they do is because they are asking "common sense" questions. Thousands of us were able to figure this out without "cyber coaches", why can't you?  BTW aren't you supposed to be eating you're prehistoric greens? |
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Post by Cambist on Jul 9, 2009 12:34:45 GMT -5
All D9 organizations promote the betterment of the black community. Members of these organizations are role models and beacons of perseverance and dedication to service. Don't these organizations aspire to bring in new generations of people dedicated to uplifting the community? If so---why does expressing interest become a game of menial do's and dont's and fear of "blackballing"? Everyone ( I would hope) was once an aspirant, so why then as members of the organization is there chastisement and pushing aspirants away?! You were once in our shoes. I by no means admire WGLO's , however I do agree with their openness to speaking with aspirants . I believe there should be a challenging process ----challenge cultivates growth. But challenge has been replaced by cattiness and all sorts of ridiculousness. I'm a D9 interest, I'm beginning to understand "The Game", but I'm just wondering why it has to be a game.....I look forward to responses! Re-read this question. What's wrong with it? I'm sure every one of you either asked it or had a LS/LB who did. |
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Post by Julie Art on Jul 9, 2009 12:45:06 GMT -5
OK Cam. If you can't see it, then hey. No matter WHAT we say will mean anything to you.
But aspirants, all greeks aren't like Cam (as evident by how many are disagreeing with him in this thread). Something to think about.
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Post by Cambist on Jul 9, 2009 12:49:19 GMT -5
This person is venting and asking a question as an anonymous poster on a message board full of greeks. If she wanted to vent to someone on her campus (and not get chosen and possibly get her ass kicked too) then that would be different. No one knows this person. She's looking for insight. Will she get it? Maybe...maybe not.
What is the problem? Tell me what i'm missing here?
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Post by Troopa1911 on Jul 9, 2009 12:55:01 GMT -5
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Post by T-Rex91 on Jul 9, 2009 12:59:28 GMT -5
That's worth an exalt... I'm not sure if you'll actually get it, but it's worth one. I'll have to think about it. BTW aren't you supposed to be eating you're prehistoric greens? Oh so now dinosaurs can't multi-task?: Respect my skillz, whippersnapper  *slaps Damie with her tail and goes back to grazing* |
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Post by T-Rex91 on Jul 9, 2009 13:00:09 GMT -5
Troopa, you are straight silly!
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Post by icebraka on Jul 9, 2009 13:00:22 GMT -5
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Post by DamieQue™ on Jul 9, 2009 13:52:27 GMT -5
All D9 organizations promote the betterment of the black community. Members of these organizations are role models and beacons of perseverance and dedication to service. Don't these organizations aspire to bring in new generations of people dedicated to uplifting the community? If so---why does expressing interest become a game of menial do's and dont's and fear of "blackballing"? Everyone ( I would hope) was once an aspirant, so why then as members of the organization is there chastisement and pushing aspirants away?! You were once in our shoes. I by no means admire WGLO's , however I do agree with their openness to speaking with aspirants . I believe there should be a challenging process ----challenge cultivates growth. But challenge has been replaced by cattiness and all sorts of ridiculousness. I'm a D9 interest, I'm beginning to understand "The Game", but I'm just wondering why it has to be a game.....I look forward to responses! Re-read this question. What's wrong with it? I'm sure every one of you either asked it or had a LS/LB who did.
Further if you know it's a game - then why ask? They had figured out that much before they even got here. They are agreeing with having a challenging process - and then complaining about it - LOL.
And if that wasn't enough... the poster apparently knows that if you express interest you might meet with people who don't seem to want to help y0u out, answer your question - but they arrive here and you feel they should expect something different? LOL.
LOL - I mean Cam come on. The poster hit the nail on the head with the title. We were there also. We got through without the internet. It makes alot more sense to just lurk than to "vent" about something you already know and expect. |
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Post by Cambist on Jul 9, 2009 14:02:09 GMT -5
But that's my point....we all come here to blow off steam and fuck off. She asked a question she seemed to already have the answer to.
Juicy-
What if some interest would have come up to you and asked you this question TO YOUR FACE, when you were in undergrad? What would you have said?
Exactly.
It's the internet. She doesn't seem to want or need an answer but if she gets on....even if it's from several different perspectives and different organizations maybe it will satisfy her curiosity.
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Post by DamieQue™ on Jul 9, 2009 14:06:41 GMT -5
But that's my point....we all come here to blow off steam and fuck off. She asked a question she seemed to already have the answer to. Juicy- What if some interest would have come up to you and asked you this question TO YOUR FACE, when you were in undergrad? What would you have said? Exactly. It's the internet. She doesn't seem to want or need an answer but if she gets on....even if it's from several different perspectives and different organizations maybe it will satisfy her curiosity.
Just a thought, maybe it might help if she actually KNEW Juicy before she asked her something about her org. Agree? |
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{=}{/=}
"They get two Roos and a snap." ~ perroloco{=}http://s2.images.proboards.com/tongue.gif{/=}{=}http://s2.images.proboards.com/tongue.gif{/=}
, sorority/fraternity life is not a right of college, it's a perk. It's a priviledge that should be limited to the best and the brightest. Just because you want it, doesn't mean you should get it. It should be sought after and earned and common sense is a really good trait in an applicant. Some of the reason that aspirants get the responses they do is because they are asking "common sense" questions. Thousands of us were able to figure this out without "cyber coaches", why can't you? 
BTW aren't you supposed to be eating you're prehistoric greens? 