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Post by jay0heavenly on Feb 11, 2008 10:06:47 GMT -5
Even for one second, seriously entertained the thought of renouncing your organization for SPIRITUAL reasons?
If so, why?
P.S. I phrased the question in such a manner that you can answer affirmatively without seeming like your bipolar...lol.
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Post by coldfront06 on Feb 11, 2008 10:09:02 GMT -5
No...I see no conflict
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Post by Ms. RedamnDickulous on Feb 11, 2008 10:12:08 GMT -5
No not at all. My org has never asked or caused me to deviate from my spiritual walk. And yes, Re Re has a spiritual walk.
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Post by jay0heavenly on Feb 11, 2008 10:12:47 GMT -5
Have you EVER seen a conflict...even for a minute?
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Post by jay0heavenly on Feb 11, 2008 10:14:28 GMT -5
*Side Note*
Ya'll are confusing the heck outa me with all these different screen names... I don't know who 83% of yall are sometimes....lol.
Shout out to ColdFront for keeping it the same! lol.
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Post by Ms. RedamnDickulous on Feb 11, 2008 10:24:02 GMT -5
Ummm, everyone knows who Re Re is, lol. Reflection08.
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Post by No Screen Name on Feb 11, 2008 10:25:06 GMT -5
Hey, Jay--my original name is in my siggy. I'm the poster formerly known as "Z"! ;D Anyway, to answer your question: NO. My org and its' principles are not in conflict with my belief in Jesus Christ. I *DO* think that I have a tendancy to put too much focus on OTHER things in my life, and not enough time on praying, reading God's Word, and focusing on the things of God--including (but definitely not limited to) my organization.  But this doesn't make the org ITSELF evil or un-Godly--it means I need to get focused on God, and give him the same (or really even MORE) time as my other pursuits. If it wasn't my org, it would be something else (and it oftentime is). I'm working and praying about this. |
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Post by Prissy New Year!!! on Feb 11, 2008 10:28:56 GMT -5
Even for one second, seriously entertained the thought of renouncing your organization for SPIRITUAL reasons? If so, why? P.S. I phrased the question in such a manner that you can answer affirmatively without seeming like your bipolar...lol. Honestly, I have. I can understand the conflict between taking secret oaths and pledging yourself to something other than Christ. It could seem like your organization is an idol. |
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Post by Cambist on Feb 11, 2008 10:37:01 GMT -5
Sup Jay?
When I first became a mason I was introduced to information (outside of the actual masonic "work") that forced me to rethink or at least question what I was taught.
It made me step away from both Masonry and the institution of Christianity...or at least the mechanical ritualizations of it.
It took years of reading, praying and LISTENING before I found what I believe to be my religious reality. This reality exists somewhere outside of the legislated bounds of formal Christianity and would in some (read: many) circles not be considered "true" Christianity.
I mention all of that to say this....I was raised a mason 14 years ago and it was during that time that I dealt with this conflict. Before I became an Alpha, I reached back on the same studies and questions I asked after becoming a mason. Just for the record....there is no comparison and for Alpha...there is no conflict....Not even a little bit.
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Post by No Screen Name on Feb 11, 2008 10:39:39 GMT -5
So what EXACTLY do you believe?
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Post by DamieQue™ on Feb 11, 2008 10:50:20 GMT -5
Honestly - no conflict. The closest thing to it, at least within my contemplation, would be the whole "unevenly yoked" precept and to my mind's eye the applicability of that could be ambiguous in many instances.
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Post by jay0heavenly on Feb 11, 2008 10:55:26 GMT -5
@ Reflection...GOT IT! lol... <===Just put 2 and 2 together  @ Z... Thanks for keeping your O-REE-G-NAL screename in your sig....I always know who you are. @ Cam... I hear what your saying...and I didn't read the "What do you believe thread", did you post in that? I'd be interested in hearing your views on issues like the Resurrection, Did Jesus NEED to die?, The impact of other religions on the Christian teaching that Jesus was the only way etc. <===Is the SOLE judge, juror and bailiff in the court of what is right!!! lol...j/k. |
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Post by jay0heavenly on Feb 11, 2008 10:59:52 GMT -5
Honestly - no conflict. The closest thing to it, at least within my contemplation, would be the whole "unevenly yoked" precept and to my mind's eye the applicability of that could be ambiguous in many instances. Damie...I see the Obama plug in your avitar so you're obviously as astute in evading questions as a politician...lol. So my good sir, I shall rephrase...lol... has the "unevenly yoked" argument ever shaken your stance and had you think, even for a second about renouncing? Hence the question is not what you think now...since the purple font suggests you are still now and for the forseeable future a proud member of Omega Psi Phi, rather in times past have you ever seen a conflict, EVEN if you later resolved that there is none at all. |
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Post by Cambist on Feb 11, 2008 11:03:54 GMT -5
I would have to answer them one at a time Jay and Z. And I, in no way, claim to have written new doctrine for a new wave of Christians. This is my personal battle and is therefore subject to change.
There are just some things that I do not believe.
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Post by jay0heavenly on Feb 11, 2008 11:05:37 GMT -5
gotcha
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Post by Nupey on Feb 11, 2008 11:18:07 GMT -5
Good Question Jay....
I have went back and studied the Ritual and recalled a few things in the Fraternity, and personally I agree with you jay, I do see things that seem to contradict my faith. But at the same time, denoucing doesn't change the fact that I ALREADY WENT through the ritual. Its not like I go through the ritual every day. So I just keep it moving...
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Post by DamieQue™ on Feb 11, 2008 11:29:00 GMT -5
I'm really not trying to play the semantic game with these answers but to me, a conflict to me represents a verified problem, not a potential one.
www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/conflict
I can see how you could equate issue with conflict or concern with conflict though. For me it just wouldn't apply. Of the ideas of the Fraternity, none of those cause concern at all. Plus I prayed on being allowed to pursue the Fraternity before I even went after it.
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Post by Cambist on Feb 11, 2008 11:29:35 GMT -5
To Nupes point...
As someone who has WRITTEN several rituals, I can attest that there may be some conflict in some organizations rituals. But honestly, many are quick fixes.
Many rituals are based in story lines. These ficitonal story lines are allegorical and merely exist to convey a message to members. They are not statements of religious belief or allegiance and are hardly ever taken as such.
Can these stories be taken out of context? Of course.
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Post by Nupey on Feb 11, 2008 11:31:59 GMT -5
To Nupes point... As someone who has WRITTEN several rituals, I can attest that there may be some conflict in some organizations rituals. But honestly, many are quick fixes. Many rituals are based in story lines. These ficitonal story lines are allegorical and merely exist to convey a message to members. They are not statements of religious belief or allegiance and are hardly ever taken as such. Can these stories be taken out of context? Of course.
I'on know...I'm just saying.. |
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Post by water on Feb 11, 2008 11:47:10 GMT -5
I thought about after that mason told me whats was up in 2001 and 2 weeks later was ooouuttt......but before that i only just wondered why people would denounce somethin as awesome as Omega Psi Phi. ... The Universal Brotherhood of Man and the Fatherhood of God is the reason I stepped .
Yes its Water AKA Brother PHIL back on the scene .... crispy and clean ...new baby boy .... yall know what i mean.... still in my lane foot foot on the throttle....
bible in my hand with the new blue bottle......soy milk and diapers thats how i roll.....
biblebeater what i got somethin for yo soul....dont get mad , no need to hate......i really was that, so you know i didnt skate.....i preach in the prison and i got a ghetto pass....
agape love is the only love that last.....preachin in the streets is where it really work .......if you scarred homie then you need to go to church ....... Yahshua is God ,you can have your architect.....if you pledge then you really need to get some neck.......fresh for 2008
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Post by DamieQue™ on Feb 11, 2008 11:50:56 GMT -5
I hear what you're saying Nupey but...
...friendship conveys the message of my fraternity. And that is neither a false god, idol, or deity. In any event, making reference to Greek Mythology is really no big deal. I do not refer to Christianity as Christian Mythology because to me there is no myth about it.
Greek mythology to me is like Aesop's fables... and I do not have to swear any allegiance or oaths to the characters in the fables nor pay them any godly homage - in order to read their respective stories and learn something from them.
Jesus however is not a myth. His existence might have been predicted in the Bible, but His presence was recorded by MORE than just the Bible. There are worlds of difference in my mind.
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Post by coldfront06 on Feb 11, 2008 12:14:01 GMT -5
I thought about after that mason told me whats was up in 2001 and 2 weeks later was ooouuttt......but before that i only just wondered why people would denounce somethin as awesome as Omega Psi Phi. ... The Universal Brotherhood of Man and the Fatherhood of God is the reason I stepped . Yes its Water AKA Brother PHIL back on the scene .... crispy and clean ...new baby boy .... yall know what i mean.... still in my lane foot foot on the throttle.... bible in my hand with the new blue bottle......soy milk and diapers thats how i roll..... biblebeater what i got somethin for yo soul....dont get mad , no need to hate......i really was that, so you know i didnt skate.....i preach in the prison and i got a ghetto pass.... agape love is the only love that last.....preachin in the streets is where it really work .......if you scarred homie then you need to go to church ....... Yahshua is God ,you can have your architect.....if you pledge then you really need to get some neck.......fresh for 2008 I'm about to start calling you MC Water |
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Post by jay0heavenly on Feb 11, 2008 12:16:12 GMT -5
I thought about after that mason told me whats was up in 2001 and 2 weeks later was ooouuttt......but before that i only just wondered why people would denounce somethin as awesome as Omega Psi Phi. ... The Universal Brotherhood of Man and the Fatherhood of God is the reason I stepped . Yes its Water AKA Brother PHIL back on the scene .... crispy and clean ...new baby boy .... yall know what i mean.... still in my lane foot foot on the throttle.... bible in my hand with the new blue bottle......soy milk and diapers thats how i roll..... biblebeater what i got somethin for yo soul....dont get mad , no need to hate......i really was that, so you know i didnt skate.....i preach in the prison and i got a ghetto pass.... agape love is the only love that last.....preachin in the streets is where it really work .......if you scarred homie then you need to go to church ....... Yahshua is God ,you can have your architect.....if you pledge then you really need to get some neck.......fresh for 2008 LOL...WATER!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Glad to have you on board doc! |
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Post by No Screen Name on Feb 11, 2008 12:44:06 GMT -5
Yeah, even when I was a Brownie/Girl Scout, they would tell little stories when we had little ceremonies (like the "Flying Up" ceremony when you went from being a Brownie to being a Cadette) and they'd make you do little stuff like crossing a little bridge...one of the stories was about a magical elf or something. They were just allegories...not to be taken seriously.
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Post by Ms. RedamnDickulous on Feb 11, 2008 12:48:32 GMT -5
SHHHHHH! You are revealing esoteric information meant only for the members of the Order of The Girls Scouts. SMH!
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Post by No Screen Name on Feb 11, 2008 12:54:55 GMT -5
*GIGGLE* ;D Most of our "esoteric" ceremonies took place in full view of our parents in the church basement!  Seriously though, I think water or somebody one time said that Scouts was not of God. |
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Post by Ms. RedamnDickulous on Feb 11, 2008 13:07:56 GMT -5
All my honor, I will try to serve God, my country, people.....I swear those were the first few words of our pledge. Had I known we were secret agents of the devil, part of the Trilateral Commission, I would have renounced and turned in my Trefoils and Thin Mint Cookies. I'm done.
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Post by No Screen Name on Feb 11, 2008 13:14:26 GMT -5
ROFL!!!! ;D You KNOW that is an oath...and oaths are EVIL!  ;D The end of the pledge went, "...and to live by the Girl Scout Law". Living under any other "law" other than God's Law is a SIN!  |
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Post by Ms. RedamnDickulous on Feb 11, 2008 13:26:09 GMT -5
Well, bless me father, for I have sinned.
<------ Lived under the GS Law for 8 years.
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Post by water on Feb 11, 2008 14:35:31 GMT -5
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But this doesn't make the org ITSELF evil or un-Godly--it means I need to get focused on God, and give him the same (or really even MORE) time as my other pursuits.
