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Post by DamieQue™ on Mar 22, 2010 13:51:20 GMT -5
I ran into an old school black woman who is an administrative assistant to the Program Director (administrative assistant meaning secretary) - let's call her Brianne.
Anyway she's old school. Now I for one am all for making friends where it benefits my cause to do so (and this usually includes the administrative assistant) but one day I called her by her first name... and she bristled, and insisted that I put a handle on it... i.e. Ms Brianne.
Apparently even in my mid 30's she feels I'm young enough that I should give her a title. But we are at work, and as best I can tell it is not a requirement that has been asked of younger white co-workers.
What would YOU do?
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Post by ReignMan19 on Mar 22, 2010 13:58:10 GMT -5
I'm ol skool and I automatically call old black ladies Ms.... Whatever
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Post by Mrs. Eyes on Mar 22, 2010 14:00:53 GMT -5
First I'd laugh inwardly, cuz she full of shit. LOL! damn Enter button!
But seriously, I'd still call her Ms. Whatever, but the fact that she allows her white co-workers to call her whatever and not give her a title, I call bullshit.
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Post by Kryptik on Mar 22, 2010 14:14:32 GMT -5
"WE" are really into that "respect my authority" thing.
In my current work situation, I would still introduce myself as "Kryptik" and not expect anything more, then while introducing myself to someone who is not my "boss" but effectively a superior( and "old school black woman") , I had the following convo...
Me: Hello, My name is Kryptik KoolKat and I was hired by "our boss" to ...
Her: Ohh, How are you classified?
Me: Umm (Really confused now), I'm a graduate now working for "our Boss?".
Her: But, How are you classified...?
Me: Umm, I have a Ph.D. in...
Her: (She interrupts) Ahh, Dr. KoolKat, I'm Dr. "Respectme", but you can call me Kim, what is your area?... (Trivial Convo ensues)
Some people are really into to that respect thing, whether it be Sir and Ma'am or the use of titles.
Where "We" are concerned, I say you call her Ms. Brianne and I would keep saying Yes Ma'am and No Ma'am to her too! ;D
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Post by Julie Art on Mar 22, 2010 15:11:24 GMT -5
I ran into an old school black woman who is an administrative assistant to the Program Director (administrative assistant meaning secretary) - let's call her Brianne.
Anyway she's old school. Now I for one am all for making friends where it benefits my cause to do so (and this usually includes the administrative assistant) but one day I called her by her first name... and she bristled, and insisted that I put a handle on it... i.e. Ms Brianne.
Apparently even in my mid 30's she feels I'm young enough that I should give her a title. But we are at work, and as best I can tell it is not a requirement that has been asked of younger white co-workers.
What would YOU do? I call people who are beneth me on the pay scale (i.e. secretaries, etc.) but older Ms. So and So, simply because that is how I was taught. Doesn't matter their job handle, if they are much older than me (i.e. got kids my age or older) they are getting that handle. |
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Post by Oren Ishii on Mar 22, 2010 15:14:41 GMT -5
My office is 1st name basis for everyone, so that's what I adhere to.
Out side the office, it's Ms./Mr. for people older than I, at least in the South. Elsewhere, most prefer first names
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Post by Chal™ on Mar 22, 2010 15:20:31 GMT -5
I say Ms, Mrs, or Mr regardless. That's just me. Now, my superiors it's "Mr. Robinson" or Mrs. Michaels. With my equals, it depends on how you were introduced. With my subordinates, it's Ms. Sallie, or Ms. Freddie, or even Ms. Shaunkwaneetah. The only time you catch me without the title is if I simply address you by your last name.
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Post by ReignMan19 on Mar 22, 2010 15:21:14 GMT -5
I ran into an old school black woman who is an administrative assistant to the Program Director (administrative assistant meaning secretary) - let's call her Brianne.
Anyway she's old school. Now I for one am all for making friends where it benefits my cause to do so (and this usually includes the administrative assistant) but one day I called her by her first name... and she bristled, and insisted that I put a handle on it... i.e. Ms Brianne.
Apparently even in my mid 30's she feels I'm young enough that I should give her a title. But we are at work, and as best I can tell it is not a requirement that has been asked of younger white co-workers.
What would YOU do? I call people who are beneth me on the pay scale (i.e. secretaries, etc.) but older Ms. So and So, simply because that is how I was taught. Doesn't matter their job handle, if they are much older than me (i.e. got kids my age or older) they are getting that handle. Yep.. its home training I can't turn it off... |
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Post by Chal™ on Mar 22, 2010 15:22:45 GMT -5
oh, i yes/no ma'am/sir all day every day. that has nothing to do with age though. it's just a habit
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Post by QueenOH on Mar 22, 2010 15:29:47 GMT -5
I can't say no to older people so is she asked to be called Miss then I would.
My friend introduced me to her nephews as Miss Queen one time. I was taken back because I didn't think I was old enough for that title. I guess I'm old to the little 5 and 6 year olds
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Post by ReignMan19 on Mar 22, 2010 15:31:40 GMT -5
I hate being called Mr. Reigny... thats my dad...
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Post by DamieQue™ on Mar 22, 2010 15:33:50 GMT -5
it is not a requirement that has been asked of younger white co-workers.
Just making sure you all saw this part.
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Post by ReignMan19 on Mar 22, 2010 15:37:35 GMT -5
it is not a requirement that has been asked of younger white co-workers.
Just making sure you all saw this part. Yep I did and my view remains the same. I think its an US thing... |
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Post by Oren Ishii on Mar 22, 2010 15:37:41 GMT -5
I did, D...and we're ---->HERE<----. It's funny to me when people need to feel some level of "perceived superiority" over our own people. Harkens back to the overseers back in the day to me... it is not a requirement that has been asked of younger white co-workers.
Just making sure you all saw this part. |
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Post by QueenOH on Mar 22, 2010 15:45:48 GMT -5
it is not a requirement that has been asked of younger white co-workers.
Just making sure you all saw this part. I still wouldn't be able to say something to her about it because she is old. |
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Post by ReignMan19 on Mar 22, 2010 15:53:11 GMT -5
Respect does not equate perceived superiority. Ms. Myra is an administrative assistant. I am a Manager. I KNOW she isn't in any way superior to me, however I do respect the fact that she has lived a long life and I will respect THAT by addressing her in a manner appriopriate of a person of advanced age. Again its not wrong or right. Its a manners thing. It is very African American though I did, D...and we're ---->HERE<----. It's funny to me when people need to feel some level of "perceived superiority" over our own people. Harkens back to the overseers back in the day to me... it is not a requirement that has been asked of younger white co-workers.
Just making sure you all saw this part. |
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Post by DamieQue™ on Mar 22, 2010 16:02:17 GMT -5
This is a tough one. What are you going to do? |
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Post by Vudu_Prince on Mar 22, 2010 16:06:15 GMT -5
knowing me.... and considering what you have put forth. I'd ignore her. I would address her in a business manner when needed but other than that I would ignore the chit out of her. I would always make eye contact as well whenever a white person addresses her to, letting it be known I notice it. She would get business respect but no sistah respect what so ever. fuck that. It sounds like the office is a business casual atmosphere so why is she ragging on you? What the fuck I guess in her mind you are the help huh?
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Post by DamieQue™ on Mar 22, 2010 16:16:01 GMT -5
knowing me.... and considering what you have put forth. I'd ignore her. I would address her in a business manner when needed but other than that I would ignore the chit out of her. I would always make eye contact as well whenever a white person addresses her to, letting it be known I notice it. She would get business respect but no sistah respect what so ever. fuck that. It sounds like the office is a business casual atmosphere so why is she ragging on you? What the fuck I guess in her mind you are the help huh?
If we were in Church or something other non-professional setting she'd get that just on GP (I get what everyone else is saying) but at work... we are peers. And if you treat everyone else like a peer (as professionalism requires) - you're gonna treat me that way too. |
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Post by Oren Ishii on Mar 22, 2010 16:30:16 GMT -5
VP, WHY are you reading my mind right now? *get outta my head!* knowing me.... and considering what you have put forth. I'd ignore her. I would address her in a business manner when needed but other than that I would ignore the chit out of her. I would always make eye contact as well whenever a white person addresses her to, letting it be known I notice it. She would get business respect but no sistah respect what so ever. fuck that. It sounds like the office is a business casual atmosphere so why is she ragging on you? What the fuck I guess in her mind you are the help huh? |
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Post by LejaOMG on Mar 22, 2010 16:31:14 GMT -5
Let me start by saying: I am not old-school. I do, however, have (quite rigorous) home training.
That said, I've gone through this ALOT. I will do no such thing. Referring to someone with a handle and their first name (i.e. Miss Leja) is a plantation-era tradition, that I find utterly irrelevant in the (professional) workplace. People underestimate the implications that naming conventions carry. Occasionally, I run across older men or women to whom I wish to show deference or respect. I address those people by their title (Dr., Judge, Professor, etc.) I do it even if their title is unwieldy (i.e. Associate Commissioner Smith or Deputy Under-Secretary Jones). Usually people with sense will eventually announce, "oh, please call me John."
If you don't have a title; and you still feel that you need a handle because I'm too young, inferior, new, inexperienced (insert adj here), I'll say Miss Koolkat (even though you probably just need to get over yourself). I'll also be sure to refer to myself as Ms. Moreno as needed on the phone and in emails. If you insist on being a d!ckhead, I'll ignore you whenever possible and if I need you for anything at all, I will not call you by name.
The same sharecropper mindset folks who require everyone to call them "Miss" are the same ones who consciously (or subconsciously) elevate white people over themselves; who genuinely believe that there are still two sets of rules for the two races (I call to mind a story my mother told about a black patient who refused to be seen by her, a Black doctor and who showed the utmost respect to a white, male nurse).
I actually have much more to say on the subject, but I'll stop here for now.
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Post by Oren Ishii on Mar 22, 2010 16:36:32 GMT -5
I wholeheartedly agree here, L. Let me start by saying: I am not old-school. I do, however, have (quite rigorous) home training. That said, I've gone through this ALOT. I will do no such thing. Referring to someone with a handle and their first name (i.e. Miss Leja) is a plantation-era tradition, that I find utterly irrelevant in the (professional) workplace. People underestimate the implications that naming conventions carry. Occasionally, I run across older men or women to whom I wish to show deference or respect. I address those people by their title (Dr., Judge, Professor, etc.) I do it even if their title is unwieldy (i.e. Associate Commissioner Smith or Deputy Under-Secretary Jones). Usually people with sense will eventually announce, "oh, please call me John." If you don't have a title; and you still feel that you need a handle because I'm too young, inferior, new, inexperienced (insert adj here), I'll say Miss Koolkat (even though you probably just need to get over yourself). I'll also be sure to refer to myself as Ms. Moreno as needed on the phone and in emails. If you insist on being a d!ckhead, I'll ignore you whenever possible and if I need you for anything at all, I will not call you by name. The same sharecropper mindset folks who require everyone to call them "Miss" are the same ones who consciously (or subconsciously) elevate white people over themselves; who genuinely believe that there are still two sets of rules for the two races (I call to mind a story my mother told about a black patient who refused to be seen by her, a Black doctor). I actually have much more to say on the subject, but I'll stop here for now. |
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Post by Vudu_Prince on Mar 22, 2010 17:00:28 GMT -5
VP, WHY are you reading my mind right now? *get outta my head!* knowing me.... and considering what you have put forth. I'd ignore her. I would address her in a business manner when needed but other than that I would ignore the chit out of her. I would always make eye contact as well whenever a white person addresses her to, letting it be known I notice it. She would get business respect but no sistah respect what so ever. fuck that. It sounds like the office is a business casual atmosphere so why is she ragging on you? What the fuck I guess in her mind you are the help huh? lol well I have been knockin on the door long enough haven't I? lol Seriously its always the mofo who have never had any power who power trip. This is coming from a person who has forced employees in the past and (the little I have now lol) to address me by my first name. We are trying to have a teamwork atmosphere yanno. Furthermore in my estimation a true professional treats everyone the same rather they are below or above you. A pet peeve of mine is seeing a mofo treat people of a lower paygrade/position like shit then turn around and brown nose your superiors. fuck on with that bullchit too. Integrity seems to be an ugly word these days. If the situation and atmosphere warrants denotations such as those put forth then I could understand and would adhere to that policy (such as the military). If the situation is business casual but someone is trying to be an ass just because then so not to cause conflict you're on timeout. No Good Morning, No Small Talk, No anything that doesn't have to do with business. I can out stern a sterner. Just imagine oneday its gonna happen... asshole Lady: Heyyyy are you busy? If not could you help with this to my car? Damie: I'm sorry Ms. asshole Lady I'm tied up at the moment. Maybe John or Mike can help you. Sorry again ma'am that I couldn't be of assistance. And I'd keep it pushing on her brown nosing ass. |
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Post by Mrs. Eyes on Mar 22, 2010 17:19:32 GMT -5
VP, WHY are you reading my mind right now? *get outta my head!* lol well I have been knockin on the door long enough haven't I? lol Seriously its always the mofo who have never had any power who power trip. This is coming from a person who has forced employees in the past and (the little I have now lol) to address me by my first name. We are trying to have a teamwork atmosphere yanno. Furthermore in my estimation a true professional treats everyone the same rather they are below or above you. A pet peeve of mine is seeing a mofo treat people of a lower paygrade/position like shit then turn around and brown nose your superiors. fuck on with that bullchit too. Integrity seems to be an ugly word these days. If the situation and atmosphere warrants denotations such as those put forth then I could understand and would adhere to that policy (such as the military). If the situation is business casual but someone is trying to be an ass just because then so not to cause conflict you're on timeout. No Good Morning, No Small Talk, No anything that doesn't have to do with business. I can out stern a sterner. Just imagine oneday its gonna happen... asshole Lady: Heyyyy are you busy? If not could you help with this to my car? Damie: I'm sorry Ms. asshole Lady I'm tied up at the moment. Maybe John or Mike can help you. Sorry again ma'am that I couldn't be of assistance. And I'd keep it pushing on her brown nosing ass. What he said. I still think she full of shit. |
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Post by Kyng of JDs on Mar 22, 2010 19:17:31 GMT -5
My office is 1st name basis for everyone, so that's what I adhere to. Out side the office, it's Ms./Mr. for people older than I, at least in the South. Elsewhere, most prefer first names *cough* older than me *cough* |
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Post by Chal™ on Mar 22, 2010 19:59:35 GMT -5
lol @ Kyng
what did you expect? she's e-engaged to Reign. Birds of a feather, man. Birds of a feather.
;D
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Post by Oren Ishii on Mar 22, 2010 21:59:54 GMT -5
Actually KYNG, in common settings during more formal eras, the use of 'than I; was always considered proper/acceptable because it implied the word (am) afterwards. In fact, this sentence structure is still regarded as correct in most settings.
With the devolution of language into a more informal style, sentences such as "people who are older than me" have become the norm, and through virtue of use, become regarded as more acceptable today.
;D
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Post by Kyng of JDs on Mar 22, 2010 22:30:47 GMT -5
and your authority is...  |
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Post by Oldskool on Mar 22, 2010 22:44:11 GMT -5
When you become my co-worker, peer, very good friend..... call me by my first name, until then I am Ms OS. I refer to all of my teachers, out of habit, as Ms or Mr somebody. It just feels strange to address them as "first name".
I'm with Damie on this one. If it is not required by all, then ignore her.
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Post by Julie Art on Mar 22, 2010 22:52:42 GMT -5
Lololololol! I came in here to say one thing and got completely side tracked with Kyng and Muse conversation!
Oh! Remember now. Just because someone uses miss or mister doesn't mean the person feels themselves to be inferior, or to even liken it to slave mentality. It could be apart of geographical culture, I.E. Southern hospitality. Just another aspect to ponder. I don't care if you are the custodian, you will be called Ms. Or Mr. Whatever out of respect. To each their own.
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